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![]() | On 27 July 2021, it was proposed that this article be moved from HeimdallrtoHeimdall. The result of the discussion was moved. |
Removed name "Geirrendour" here and in other articles as I can't find any trace of this form.
I have removed mention of "Norse society" as the ending indicates an intended Danish setting, not a Norse setting. I might have change it to "Scandinavian society", but that suggests a geographic limitation on the extent of the three races founded by Heimdall that probably wasn't thought about one way or the other by those who wrote or listened to such stories.
Removed information that Heimdall was a "light" god and "moon" god as can find no trace of either. He was a "white" god, but that may not be the same as a "light" god. "Moon god" is a strange POV identification for a god who lives at the end of the rainbow. If someone provide a source, then it is probably worth including, simply as an odd hypothesis.
There are a lot of poor links to this article.
Some just link back to Heimdall while others link to entries that give no more information than does the Heimdall entry. That is annoying to anyone who clicks on them. Such sub-stubs might belong in a mythological dictionary but I don't think such sub-stubs belong in any encyclopedia.
I'll wait about a week, but unless someone objects, I'm going to start changing these short Norse myth sub-stubs to REDIRECTs and emove the links to themfrom Heimdall and from other articles as I find them.
Jallan 00:37, 2 Aug 2004 (UTC)
http://www.thorshof.org/zheimdall.htm i think wiki should provide additional info before this can be considered wiki content. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.10.25.60 (talk • contribs) 14:38, 13 June 2006 (UTC)Reply
"Heimdall's nickname Hallinskíði ("The Literal Bent Stick") also appears as a kenning for "ram", perhaps referring to the bent horns on a ram's head."
The name might also refer to the Gjallarhorn which may have been what is known today as the Bukkehorn, an ancient Norwegian instrument made from the curved horn of a ram or goat, useful for communication and signaling as well as frightening away wild animals while herding sheep. If I or someone else can provide a source verifying this association it would make an interesting addition to the article. Cerdic 16:09, 8 July 2006 (UTC)Reply
Coming from the hometown of Henrik Ibsen, Skien, many years ago I stumbled upon a book (no longer in my posession) where Heimdallr is associated with an older (pre-viking era) deity known as Skiða. Skiða was in this book associated to a horse cult. It would be interesting if anyone could substantiate this information. --Xact (talk) 22:45, 18 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
"Skíði" (also the germanic-scandianvian variations) is from the same family word as my romanian『găteje』or greek "caduceus". It means stick (or pole/branch/twig/wreath) of wood. Heimdallr is Hermes/Mercury, folks. Check the common characteristics: rooster and messenger/herald of the gods. Bigshotnews 01:16, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
According to the Japanese wikipedia Heimdall's sword was called Burtgang, however there are no sources for this and searches have turned up very little. Anyone who is alittle more knowledgeable on the subject care to comment? ブルドガング —Preceding unsigned comment added by 諸行無常 (talk • contribs) 07:02, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
- I would like to know the reason why User:Holt is so bombastic about this? Bortgang make sense in Norwegian. Bortgang in Norwegian give the meaning 'to die', literally: 'to go away'... It is still in use. This discourse on the Asatru points at two important questions: - 1) Is Asatru to be taken seriously as a living spirituality, albeit in various processes of reconstruction - in regard of re-encountering the oriental sources/influences of the Asatru (a.k.a. faith of Asia) - and in regard of the re-occurence of shamanic practices (i.e. entheogenic medicine) that has been supressed for centuries? - 2) In stead of saying that Heimdall's sword is not called Bortgang. It would be correct to say there are little or none known written sources telling that Heimdalls sword is called Bortgang. The question is regarding to what extent do written accounts have supremacy over what might be of oral transmissions. Is it not true that the old pre-christian spirituality of Scandinavia have survived among a variety of peoples of the east described already by Snorri Sturluson and evolved to this day among the Sakhya and Bön, the Tuvanese shamans and others unknown or unbound by the occidental epistemology. How oriental traditions are rendering the Norse spirituality is of uttermost interest as it should be beyond doubt that the Norse religion/shamanism/spirituality may provide a very fascinating field of research that may deconstruct the east-west dichotomy. --Xact (talk) 00:40, 19 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
The main article states the unknown origin of the affix "dall" in the "Heimdall" name. In some central-norwegian dialects, "dall" or "dallj" usually means a worker or a even a slave or a lazy man of the countryside. This in addition to also meaning "a good portion of" butter (as in "smaer-dallj") or a decent portion of anything else related to cooking. The word is still being used by elders in parts of Norway.
An older meaning of the word can also be referring to a bowl with a lid on it, as suggested by for instance Bokmålsordboka (a norwegian web dictionary).
The icelandic language thus contains the word "dallur". —Preceding unsigned comment added by KibyNykraft1976 (talk • contribs) 23:02, 9 March 2009 (UTC)Reply
Grimm thinks the name has something to do with the heavens, pine-trees and mountains, implying that Heimdallr was originally a god of wooded mountain-tops (which links to Perkwunos rather directly). But Grimm is also aware that this is only speculation. There is no clear interpretation for the name. --dab (𒁳) 12:02, 5 May 2010 (UTC)Reply
Would someone please move this article to the Old Norse version (Heimdallr) rather than the current arbitrary choice between the two anglicizations (Heimdall, Heimdal)? :bloodofox: (talk) 15:27, 1 January 2011 (UTC)Reply
I have recently rewritten this article and created or rewritten a few related to it (Gjallarhorn, Nine Mothers of Heimdallr, Himinbjörg, Heimdalargaldr) from scratch. Here's what the article currently needs:
And likely some careful copyediting. Rígsþula also badly needs some well-referenced love (rewrite, anyone?). Enjoy! :bloodofox: (talk) 22:19, 8 January 2011 (UTC)Reply
If there's no reliable source asserting that one of Heimdall's titles include "Whitest of the Gods" I suggest removal of this line. There's a lot of recent activity related to citation tags being added/removed. I suspect this title may have been added only because of fan outrage at the casting of a black actor for Marvel Comic's film version of Thor. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.66.17.115 (talk) 05:57, 8 May 2011 (UTC)Reply
Henry Adams Bellows translation:
Himingbjorg is the eight, and Heimdall there
O'er men hold sway, it is said;
In his well-built house does the warder of heaven
The good mead gladly drink.[16]
Was the usage of "eight" and "sway" as opposed to the correct "eighth" and "sways" in the source or is it an error we have made when copying it here? --Khajidha (talk) 11:30, 23 August 2017 (UTC)Reply
Would anyone be up for putting the real texts into the article? CecilWard (talk) 15:36, 9 August 2018 (UTC)Reply
People keep tripping over this so we should try to provide more and clearer information. It's very clear that 'hvítastr' means "whitest" - the color of wheat and linen. But the connotations of describing someone as 'white' are different in the Old Norse context than they usually are in modern English. In English, 'white' is typically a racial designation. In Old Norse literature, white is the color of aristocratic beauty. I'll see about finding references that go into this. Haukur (talk) 21:07, 1 August 2019 (UTC)Reply
The result of the move request was: moved. per discussion consensus. This was a hard one. We have, on one hand, the fact that more robust and good scholarly sources more often use the more traditional spelling. And it is true that google results are likely flawed, given that more traditional sources are so often left out. On the other side, we have COMMONNAME, naturalness, recognizability, and that this is the English language wikipedia, so we call Deutschland "Germany", Nippon "Japan", and, apparently, Nilfheimr "Nilfheim." It appears, from the discussion participants who have responded in past 4 weeks (and 2 relists, mass advertisements, etc), that the English spelling is what most editors prefer. Remember, we can always revisit this down the road. And another road worth considering is to make a broader discussion about all of these norse pages, trying to unify the style. Or trying to get consensus on a MOS entry. But as a closer of this particular discussion, I must operate by the evident consensus. Which, here, is in favor of the move. (non-admin closure) — Shibbolethink (♔ ♕) 21:33, 25 August 2021 (UTC)Reply
Heimdallr → Heimdall – Per WP:COMMONNAME. We should be using English not Old Norse.
Britannica uses Heimdall. MClay1 (talk) 03:39, 27 July 2021 (UTC)— Relisted. 2pou (talk) 17:38, 5 August 2021 (UTC) — Relisting. Shibbolethink (♔ ♕) 23:52, 16 August 2021 (UTC)Reply
To expand on that, they use common English versions for all the gods, as well as mentioning the Old Norse spelling. MClay1 (talk) 04:45, 29 July 2021 (UTC)Reply
— Relisted to gain a more clear consensus given conflicting policies and sources. We want the outcome to be clear and robust. Shibbolethink (♔ ♕) 23:56, 16 August 2021 (UTC)Reply
— advertised at WikiProject Mythology 23:56, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
— advertised at WikiProject Religion 23:56, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
@Jallan, Cerdic, Xact, Bigshotnews, Holt, KibyNykraft1976, Dbachmann, Haukurth, Guppyfinsoup, Khajidha, and CecilWard: Pinging past participants on the talk page to see if we can get some more opinions after the relistings. MClay1 (talk) 13:06, 19 August 2021 (UTC)Reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
What's the source for the word-final "r" being pronounced as a voiced alveolar retracted sibilant? WP Ludicer (talk) 08:45, 27 November 2022 (UTC)Reply