| This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Criticism of the BBC article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies |
| Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 125 days  |
| This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Criticism of the BBC article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies |
| Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
| Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3Auto-archiving period: 125 days |
 | This article is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||||||||||
I have archived this topic, as it is now well over a year since the main debate, and this is a very long debate on a very long page. However, I think it is worth leaving a note to say that edits were made to this page from BBC IPs (e.g. [1] and [2]), and that if you do work for the BBC and are reading this, please read WP:COI before making edits.Pit-yacker (talk)
I've made a change in this area as Paxman's article was being misrepresented
This article is about criticism of the BBC. The source article suggests that partiality may be necessary in the case of climate change just as the BBC shows partiality about racism, it is not a criticism of that partiality. The selective use of the quote in this article implied that Paxman thought that the bbc was lacking impartiality and so exitbiting bias. These are two different things
Also the rest of this section appears to be no more than a criticism of a campaign which never happened surley not worthy of inclusion? The BBC must have thousands of projects that never get off the drawing board. Pete the pitiless (talk) 22:08, 23 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Nothing on secular criticism of the BBC using public money to produce religious programming? It's quite a big criticism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.46.172.25 (talk) 15:40, 28 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]
There seems to be a bias towards Roman Catholicism. The present Director-General is RC, as was John Birt. And on the BBC website over a period of three years 75% of pictures of "Christians celebrating Palm Sunday" and Easter were of RCs. Ausseagull (talk) 13:34, 28 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
BBC claim to show impartiality in disputes between Palestinians and Israelis yet is never able to be critical of any Isreal's action including the latest act of piracy and murder on the high seas. However they nearly always support their TV reports of outrageous Israeli aggression against Palestinians with Israeli gathered TV news footage. We are often deceived into thinking the images that the BBC are leading with are impartial or neutral. Israeli news footage should not be presented as if it is BBC's own news footage. In the 31 May 2010 incident where Israeli paratroopers boarded a Turkish vessel bring aid to Gaza they used Israeli footage of their troops coming under attack from passengers. Some footage was clearly produced in an Israeli studio showing troops beaten with iron bars. The standard practice in all such incidents would be to show seriously wounded soldiers to support the killing of 8 peace protesters as justification preventing loss of Israeli lives but of course there were no images to back-up this central Israeli propaganda claim that soldiers were taking a vicious beating. It is in this that the BBC can be seen to be lightly critical whilst remaining fundamentally loyal to the Israeli cause. In this example from bbc.co.uk the Israeli accusations are given absolute prominence even as the alleged aggressors and counter claims by the victims dwindle off into insignificance.
[Israel says its soldiers boarded the lead ship in the early hours but were attacked with axes, knives, bars and at least two guns. "Unfortunately this group were dead-set on confrontation," Israeli government spokesman Mark Regev told the BBC. "Live fire was used against our forces. They initiated the violence, that's 100% clear," he said. Organisers of the flotilla said at least 30 people were wounded in the incident. Israel says 10 of its soldiers were injured, one seriously. Deputy Speaker of Israeli parliament Danny Danon: "It was not a peaceful mission" A leader of Israel's Islamic Movement, Raed Salah, who was on board, was among those hurt. Contact with activists on the ships was lost after the raids and no first-hand accounts from them have yet emerged. Arafat Shoukri, of the Free Gaza Movement (FGM) which organised the convoy, said those on board one ship had told them by telephone that Israeli helicopters had arrived. "Then we started to hear screams, shouting, shooting everywhere," he said. "We heard some of them shouting 'we are raising the white flag, stop shooting at us'." He said Israeli claims that activists had pistols and other weapons were "cheap propaganda". Audrey Bomse, also of the FGM, told the BBC that the activists were "not going to pose any violent resistance". By midday Israel had towed three of the six boats to the port of Ashdod and says it will deport the passengers from there.]
This demonstrates a clear case of taking the Israeli side while appearing impartial. 86.181.153.42 (talk) 10:00, 9 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Don't quite understand your objection - of course it is my opinion. Can't see any logic to your suggestion that my understanding of BBC bias would best be served by a reliable criticism and not by my personal opinion. If you read the criticism you'd see that my opinion is a reliable source because it is supported by empirical evidence. I think you are saying you do not agree but can't quite find a logical point to argue on. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.181.153.42 (talk) 23:02, 10 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
How can it be justified that nearly all voices coming out of BBC are public school educated. You hear the same nasal public school twangs from a monty don, a griff rhys jones, a michael palin, a rick stein, a clarkson, a rory mcgrath, a marc urban, a peter snow, a paxman, a dimblebee, an attenborough, a simon shcama, an andrew graham-dixon, a john simpson, a euen davis, a titmarsh, a bill odie, a dan cruishank, a jeremy vine, a clive anderson, a stephen fry, an ian hislop, a david mitchell, an alexander armstrong, an andy hamilton, a nicholas parsons, a michael makintyre, a john humphries oh and the one female that sounds like a blend of them all jo brand and you just got to love her cousin (?) russell brand who tries to disguise his painful public school origins by 'tryin to sound common' - the list is endless and quite excruciaing to those of us of humble birth - a few grammar school exceptions like a merton, a childs, a lineker or, a ross do not constitute balance. Clearly a case of the upper classes 'parasiting' off the majority of licence fee payers who are from the poorer classes. Chenzxl (talk) 00:10, 11 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Most of the Scottish voices are similarly from the elite nasal tones of public school educated scotsmen. THe Beeb needs more common voices on music radio like Moyles and Evans (still public school educated)to hook in young under-developed educationally maturing minds. This soften them to the idea that more BBC is representative of society at large. The real elitism is hidden by carefully concealing that all these other Beeb regulars are connected through the old school tie network. Of course all of this sounds like opinion but there is a verifiable context to this just check the school back grounds of the majority of beeb regulars and there you have it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.181.153.42 (talk) 11:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Why is there no mention of the BBC right wing bias? it has always supported the establishment, was far heavy in its criticism of labour governments than tory ones, and has had always maintained a unionist position against republican and nationalist politicians. This article seems to bias it makes no mentions of the bush adminstration pro BBC stance as the only counter to Al Jazeri in the muslim world. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.44.19.153 (talk) 16:25, 12 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Well, even if everything in this article is the truth, the whole thruth and nothing but the truth - is "Criticism of the BBC" really an encyclopedical article ? It would not accour in any other encyclopedia. What's next ? An article of "criticism of the gunners midfield " perhaps ? 83.249.42.14 (talk) 06:05, 21 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Hi, I've just registered and this is my first point, so please go easy on me if I do something wrong. I won't change anything on the page itself.
I was arguing on a blog about the BBC and got pointed to the "Admission to Anti-Christian bias" section. The supporting link doesn't really seem to support the assertions in the section.
The section says: "The BBC has admitted (2006) of being biased, of cultural liberal bias,[32] biased on relgion and on politics[33] The internal memo, discovered by the British media, revealed that the BBC was guilty of promoting Left-wing views and anti-Christian sentiment."
The MailOnline article, however, attributes the "cultural liberal bias" quote to Andrew Marr, who is not "The BBC". The Mail's article is based upon a "leaked account" of a meeting. Is it OK to base parts of encyclopaedia articles on leaked memos? Is the memo genuine? How do we know it's genuine? Was the meeting of sufficient importance to be able to attribute anything said there to "The BBC"? A group of executives and high profile presenters isn't necessarily representative of "The BBC".
I also think "guilty of promoting Left-wing views" isn't very neutral. Being left-wing isn't a crime! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Theresonator (talk • contribs) 18:44, 26 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I can't get indenting to work! I appear to have picked a section which is in a bit of a mess for my first time on Wikipedia. The section contains two sources. The Mail talks about "A leaked account" and a "secret meeting". The Evening Standard talks about details being "leaked". The article reflects this sense of secrecy by saying "The internal memo, discovered by the British media". It wasn't a memo. It was a seminar. And the seminar was streamed live on the web, so it wasn't a secret at all. The pdf of the seminar transcript is available here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/assets/files/pdf/review_report_research/impartiality_21century/d_seminar_transcript.pdf
And the pdf brings me to the next point. The claims that the "Admission to Anti-Christian bias" section makes about what was actually said. All "admissions" are credited to "The BBC". The first admission is of "cultural liberal bias" and that was made by Andrew Marr. The next is that the BBC is "biased on relgion and on politics". Without more specificity, it's difficult to know what they are referring to. Maybe this part refers to what the sources (Mail and Evening Standard} say. Both sources say that the BBC executives would screen a Bible being thrown away on a fictional episode of Room 101, but wouldn't show a Koran being thrown away. But reading the transcript, although Alan Yentob umms and ahhs about whether throwing the Koran away would cause greater offence, most of those involved seem to say that throwing the Bible or Koran away would be unacceptable.
I think this section is so full of errors that it might as well be deleted, but I don't want to, or know how to, do that. Theresonator (talk) 21:30, 26 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I've deleted it, and I must say I was rather pleased to note that the reference numbers and table of contents auto update. Wootcannon (talk) 03:27, 5 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
More edits from me, because it seems that other material was added by the person who added this section, and all three things I have deleted referred to the admission of liberal bias in 2006 by the BBC (Not sourced, and as far as I am aware, nonexistent), and referred to articles that were essentially opinion pieces. Wootcannon (talk) 03:44, 5 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The BBC has admitted (2006) of being biased, of cultural liberal bias,[1] biased on religion and on politics[2] The internal memo, discovered by the British media, revealed that the BBC was guilty of promoting Left-wing views and anti-Christian sentiment.[citation needed]
BBC's admission to liberal bias in 2006, has highlighted what "The British Broadcasting Corporation has been struggling for several years against criticisms and claims of biased reporting concerning the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and distorted coverage of the global fight against terror," explained Ynet.[3]
Not well attributed, but that can be changed, rather than deleted. Christopher Connor (talk) 04:37, 5 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
