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Talk:Saudi Arabia

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- – February 2006

• "Saudi Arabia": 99,700,000 Google hits
• "KSA" Saudi: 318,000 hits.

That clearly makes it less common, even though it's the IOC code. - Eagle^amn 22:20, 3 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

While that's not exactly the best way to find out, I a do agree, KSA is far less common, escpially since KSA can't be translated back into Arabic. Burning phoneix 10:25, 5 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to know more about Saudi Arabia's history. The history section seems very small for such a large and powerful country.

This section is mostly about revenue and economic performance. I personally would like some info on governance , corruption and internal opposition. Any contributors with sources. I don't want to be confrontational or controversial but this is very closed country and English speaking media and governments are very happy to side with the Saudi regime.

I understand that there is a sizeable Shia minority in Saudi but I cannot find any reference to the its size! CIA simply says 100% Muslims but does not give a break down of each sects (as it does on other countries), has anyone got any idea? Kiumars 12:24, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would guesstimate it at about 10% shias, mainly in the east of the country. I don't have a source though :(.

There aren't any official government statistics, but I have seen many local and foreign non-official sources. Most of them give it somewhere between 10 and 20%. However, the most reliable source I've seen was a loacal Saudi newspaper that gave Saudi Arabia 85% Sunni and 15% Shia.

It says that from the CIA world fact book that 100% of the population is muslim. That is an incorrect statement. I know a few people who are citizens in Saudi Arabia who are non- Muslim. Someone needs to change that fact because I can guarentee that the CIA were incorrect in that case. Most of the citizens are Muslim.

Pretty much every book or statistic states that Saudi Arabia is 100% muslim. Just because you know a few people that would make it 99.99999999% isn't enough to change that. Burning phoneix 06:57, 6 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It sounds as if you're extremely proud that Saudi Arabia is nearly 100% muslim. Is this true? As a Canadian, coming from a multicultural, multiethnic, multireligious, pluralistic country, this attitude is baffling and appears extremely xenophobic.

Also, I was shocked to just find out that I'm forbidden from setting foot in your country simply because I'm a Jew. Do you support that law? Loomis51 11:57, 10 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If my prevouis comment seemed harsh then I apologize. It came out wrong. What I meant to tell that person was that his observations were not strong enough to submit in wikipedia.

before I respond to your comment, I would just like to note that I've lived 7 years of my childhood in Canada, so I know what it's like over there. :)

Why wouldn't I be proud that my country is nearly 100% muslim? I don't see anything wrong with that. :/

OK I see now.....your not seeing anything wrong in the fact your country Racist and the fact that non-Sunni muslims and other religious groups can't get citizenship due to religion.

Also, I beleive that Isreali citizens were barred from entering Saudi Arabia, not Jews.Burning phoneix 06:32, 11 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, no. It is Jews that are forbidden from entering Saudi Arabia.

Its funny that the whole world (except the US) keeps calling Israel an "Apartheid" state when 20% of the population are Arabs and enjoy every civil right that their fellow Jewish citizens enjoy, including, amongst other things, the right to vote, the right to be elected to the Knesset, the right to be a cabinet member etc...The Israeli Supreme Court even has an Arab as one of its associate justices. Now compare that to Saudi Arabia where a Jew is not even allowed to enter, let alone be a citizen. But for some reason Israel is always singled out. Maybe someone can explain to me why. Loomis51 01:35, 13 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This is completely OT but you seem to be missing the point. Civil rights are not a competition. The fact that Arabs have more civil rights in Israel then Jews have in Saudi Arabia is irrelevant to the issue of whether Israel's policies are fair. Although Israel does grant numerous rights to it's non-Jewish citizens, no one can deny that their policies, especially those in relation to immigration are extremely biased towards Jews over non-Jews which is what the issue is about. I personally don't agree with calling it apartheid. Although some of the policies have similarities, I think this goes too far. People throw about the word apartheid too easily not considering how extreme apartheid was. However the policies are IMHO racist and unacceptable. Again I repeat comparisons to other Arab countries is irrelevant. This is not a competition. We are not arguing which country is better. We are simply looking at the policies of the Israel in isolation. Anyway since this is so OT, will not talk or respond further. Nil Einne 19:34, 4 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Israeli jews and as a matter of fact all jews are not allowed to enter Saudi Arabia due to political tensions between the jews and arabs over Israel/Palestine.

Saudi Arabia explicitly forbids citizenship to non-sunni muslims, so no wonder its 100% muslim. So yes, it is a extremely xenophobic country and being proud of that fact can in my mind only be likened to being proud of being white in South Africa during Apartheit. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.172.93.175 (talk • contribs)

I dont agree :D hehe , dont judge before u visit it , if u live in america u can easily get a visiting visa from consolates in Housten-texax , LA-Cali , or NYC or the DC itself :) and when ever u visit it im sure u'd free ur mind from all these ideas goes in yao head cuz of sick TV channels :) , have a nice day people :) --Ammar shaker 895:867, 58 March 6706 (UTC)

That explains why when Malcom X went to Makkah and the airport security saw that he could not speak Arabic and had an Amercian passport he was taken to the religious police right?

Oh yes of course you must have forgotten to show the levels of racism in your beautiful country let me show you. If an Arab national pushes a non-Arab a Non-Arab will go to jail if he pushes back. Also White people would get better treatment then that of an Oriental/South Asian. So Race does play an important role in how you are to be treated in your country. Not trying to offend you and I apologize if I have but I was born in The Middle East in Dubai and when I went to visit Saudi Arabia They labelled me as an Indian and not by my name and specifically said "INDIANS HERE" "PAKISTANIS HERE" and so on.

"Don't judge before you visit it"? Did you not just read what I wrote? I'm afraid that I can't visit your beautiful country because I'm a Jew and your country forbids me from setting foot in your country. I guess I'll just have to look at pictures of Saudi Arabia and dream of how beautiful it is. Loomis51 01:23, 13 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm looking forward to visiting this US ally, but for now am opting to have my head remain attached to my body! El_C 07:58, 12 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

wellll mr.El_c make sure terrorists are busy in iraq now so u gotta take the chance and visit saudi before they come back hehe :D --Ammar shaker — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ammar shaker (talk • contribs) 06:41, March 13, 2006 (UTC)

The American media keeps playing with their people's heads, filling them with ideas that are far from the truth. I happen to be a Saudi Arabian studying in Montreal, Canada. I seen shows such as American Dad from FOX and I saw how the Saudi Arabian people where labeled. To quote El_C "for now am opting to have my head remain attached to my body", that's just stupid, no body will do anything to you. Saudi Arabia is not all Sunni-Muslims! there are Shia'-Muslims and there lots of foreigners, and about Malcolm X. The holy cities (Makkah & Madina) are for Muslims only, but the rest of Saudi Arabia is open for any one (except those who have an Israeli passport). --muhaidib-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 03:59, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually according to the page, in fact the rest of Saudi Arabia is not open to anyone since atheists and Jews (regardless of citizenship) can't enter. Also, it's not just Israeli passports. Anyone with an official Israeli stamp can't enter. AFAIK, the Israeli authorities are very cooperative in not stamping your passport if requested so this wouldn't be a problem to anyone who is aware however clearly the rest of Saudi Arabia isn't in fact open to everyone/anyone (except those who have an Israeli passport) as you claim. Unless the page is wrong but I don't believe it is. Nil Einne 19:41, 4 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

OK you have no clue what I meant by Malcom X and Makkah. When Malcom X went to Makkah he was taken to the reigious police because he had an American Passport and could not speak Arabic. THAT WAS IN CONNECTION TO A PERSON WHO MADE THE COMMENT ANYBODY CAN GO FREELY ANYWHERE IN SAUDI ARABIA EVEN IF YOUR AMERICAN — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.154.19.19 (talk • contribs)

Dude I told you, "he holy cities (Makkah & Madina) are for Muslims only". About Malcom X I just made a little research and found out that he was muslim, well bro you are talking about more then 40-50 years ago. Not every body spoke english so they maybe thought he was not Muslim. And yes if you are American you can come to Saudi Arabia, you just have to do the legal stuff (get a VISA and stuff) and you can come, I have invited lots of my friends from Canada over home to Riyadh. They loved it, they said aside from the women and bars, it's just like home, and a bit nicer. (They liked the big homes and nice cars everywhere). --muhaidib-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 13:19, 9 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

yo buddy i was born in Dubai so i know what its like in the middle east and i have visted both riyadh and jeddah. and saudi arabia was a british colony so it is kind of expected that they will know english. i understand MALCOM X is kind of hard to find a muslim name but i believe that his passport gave his muslim name. also i assume that the friends you invited from canada were white people. not trying to offend you but in the middle east white people do get treated better then a sounth asian. because once i was i think riaydh and i was just playing in the ariport and an arab child pushed me and i obviously pushed him back and the police actually came and arrested me. at the age of four i had a criminal record. now please explain what just happened there. as you can see saudi arabia is a little on the racist side of things and that is something you can not deny.

So you where four and an saudi kid pushed you? You are Emarati or you where just born there? Well the thing is, it's true that they treat white people better then south asians because lot's of South Asians voulintary take lower class jobs in Saudi Arabia so some might treat them as lower class people.. I personally think that those who do are stupid so whatever.. don't take it on the whole country--muhaidib-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 05:42, 13 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

nah man i am indian. and also now the south asian population in the middle east are now in like higher level jobs like managers and CEO's and they get treated like they are absolutly nothing. and also im talking about the whole country i talk about the average saudi. like the thing that got me angry was that a 4 year old child had a criminal record and almost was not able to immigrate because of it. wouldn't you be also a little angry at that fact, that you dont have the right to stick up for yourself. and also you are in very deep trouble if you are caught wearing the thobe and ghutra (the clothing and headress) could you explain why that is.

in reply to the indian, I must say that you need to know the history well. First of all Saudi Arabia was never a colony of britin. You can check make a search on the net and you will find that Saudi Arabia was never a colony of any nation. even in prehistoric times Arabia was not conquered by any nation. About the english language, it is just studied at high school and univeristy level as a forign language and few people speak it well in the country. Mainly highly educated, businessmen and who have to deal with non arabic people speak good english.

this is to reply to the indian guy, listen, I will be very honest with you. NO indian in Saudi Arabia has a high-class job, its just in Dubai where there are more indians then Emaratis. You will never find an Indian CEO in Saudi Arabia, and if you want to be treated nicley, Don't go to Saudi Arabia. And to reply to the guy who said Saudi Arabia was a British Colony, get your facts straight. Before the time of the British Colonization of Saudi Arabia was devided into different parts, mainly the Emirate of Najd, and the Kingdom of Hejaz, and there where different sections. Not untill 1932 that King Abdulaziz Al Saud united the Kingdom and became a nation, Saudi Arabia was never a British Colony, the Nation was Established as Kingdom. So, anything else? --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 13:04, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

There was no such country as india when the british colonized it but the british still called it india. India at that time was just a bunch of states. same with saudi arabia, they wont go around just naming each and every kingdom by itself. they will use an easier termomology (Arabia). no indian CEO's in saudi arabia is not what he/she meant. i think he/she meant by indian CEO's established in India and just come to Saudi Arabia for business purposes and get treated poorly. but it doesnt matter anymore really because that person was right. there are south asians in Saudi Arabia with very high level jobs in private corperations. one of my relatives work there as a corperate director. Arabia was ruled i think to some extent by the ottaman empire though, so not colony true but ruled. and for the indian man who seems to be quite angry at saudi arabia, you seem to be forgetting that India is emerging as a superpower and produce a far higher GDP compared to what saudi ever will. so i guess let them enjoy their usage of low payed workers, because it will end soon enough.

ohhh wow,, you don't know how much I am laughing right now,,, just this paragraph above was the funniest shit i have ever heard!!... first of all, about the ottoman empire, that was not colonization, they were muslim, turks/arabs, this was our empire, we (the arabs) were one before the colonization of Britain (on SOME countries such as Emirates and Qatar, not Saudi) You are saying that Saudi Arabia will never be like India, that is absolutely true,,, Saudi Arabia will never be that low! The problem with all of you is what you don't know about the country and its people, you guys believe everything the media says about the country, if you want to see who's rich around the world you go to Forbes and see that India has 4-5 billionaires and Saudi Arabia has 2-3 ? dunno what are the numbers for India but rest assured that Saudi Arabia doesn't have 2-3,, do you think that Saudis are like all other people, they cry out loud when they have money, like Americans saying "look at me I have money". It is the exact reverse, no body says anything about their wealth, This is why Forbes has such a low number for Saudis, just prince walid bn talal and two or three more. I can assure you that there are at least 100 multi-billionaires in Saudi Arabia, who?, I'm not gonna tell you. Forbes lists King Fahad (before he died) as 20-30 billion. When he died in 2005 he left 800 billion to his family (personal family, wifes and kids). So, does that say anything to you? 10%-15% of USA's money is Saudi, London is owned by Saudi business men! come on man, open your eyes! --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 23:53, 6 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The pronunciation /ˈsɒdɪ əˈɹeɪ̯bɪə/ is obviously Anglicized, but I'm not sure what the Arabic pronunciation is. Is it just /ælʕɑrɑˈbiː æsːæʕuːˈdijːæ/ as mentioned, or is the short form "Saudi Arabia" also used natively? Ardric47 21:31, 22 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"Saudi Arabia" is almost never used in Arabic, but I've seen few Arabic publications with『العربية السعودية』 /ælʕɑrɑˈbiː æsːæʕuːˈdijːæ/, probably due to mistranslation. The most common short form is『السعودية』 as-Sa'udiyah /æsːæʕuːˈdijːæ/- Eagle^talk 21:46, 22 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there, some new projects have been started to improve Saudi related topics, help is most welcomed. So if you please check out our Wikiproject Saudi Arabia which is maintaning the portal, thank you--muhaidib-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 17:10, 15 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Could someone write up on what life in Saudi Arabia in relation to office hours, school hours etc is? I got interested in this after reading the Siesta article. AFAIK, Saudi Arabia (and a number of other Middle Eastern) countries more or less completely shut down during the afternoon but I'm not completely sure. Nil Einne 19:41, 4 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hey there Nil Einne, thanks for your interest in Saudi Arabia. Well, the school hours are kind of normal, but a bit earlier then the North American schools, kids usually get up at 6-7 in the morning, they get ready for school and as I remember they start at around 8:--, classes go normal, in most schools there are about 7-8 classes of 40 minutes each, there are breaks in between, at around noon there is the Dhuhr Prayer break, around 40-60 minutes (the prayer is 20 minutes and the rest is lunch break), the school finishes as early as 2:00pm and as late as 4:00pm, depends on the school, district and if it's a private or public school (some private schools have extra curricular activities in the afternoon). But for businesses, they can vary. The day starts at around 6-7 in the morning, there is a break at Dhuhr prayer at noon, some business have a long break until sunset and then start working, and start again after 6:00pm to about 9-10 pm,, but that varies on the business type as well, offices close in the afternoon but shops and stores are usually open. All business must close at prayer times, 5 times a day that last for about 30 minutes, restaurants close their doors at prayer times but if you are already eating inside you may stay in, they just won't open the doors until the prayer is over. This is different from city to city, for example Riyadh is much more strict then Jeddah. If you have anything else please don't hesitate to ask, thank you. --muhaidib-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 02:37, 5 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, not all prayer breaks are for 30 minutes, right? I used to live in Saudi Arabia and remember some being for shorter periods (~10 minutes) than others.

That depends. If you go to a major brand-name supermarket/store, the break is longer, but if you go to a smaller local shop, the employee might just go to a nearby mosque,pray and come back immediatly. It's not set in stone.Burning phoneix 10:36, 7 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

And the weekedns are not Saturday and Sunday. The weekends are Thursday and Friday

This may change. There has been talk of changing the weekend to Friday/Saturday in line with Dubai.

Officially in Saudi Arabia it is Makkah & Madina & NOT 'Mecca' or 'Medina'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.51.0.131 (talk • contribs)

I believe that is true, but in most English sources you will find the spelling "Mecca" and "Medina." - Eagle^(talk) 20:13, 16 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Eagle, it's their language and they can spell it how ever they want, we [Arabic people] say the word "America" like "Am'ree'kah", we say "Paris" like "Pa'rees", "Montreal" like "Mont'ter'yal", "England" like "In'gelt'ra", "Switzerland" like "Swees'ra" and so on, so I guess as long as they know what they are talking about, they can call it whatever they want --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 22:28, 21 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Someone should add something about the extent to which the Saudi government indoctrinates their school children against Jews and Christians.

Here's a good article on the subject

Excerpts from modern Saudi Textbooks

sample: "As cited in Ibn Abbas: The apes are Jews, the people of the Sabbath; while the swine are the Christians, the infidels of the communion of Jesus."

Hmmm, having this issue been brought up, why don't you tell me who Israel and Western Textbooks portray Muslims??

I can't speak for Israel, but I can say that in the US, the acheivments of the Muslims are lauded, Islam is treated with respect as a "world religion", terrorism is said to be a perversion of Islam, the Crusades are portrayed as unbridled Christian aggression (while the final conquest of Constantinople, ordered by Muhammed, is treated as just another historical event), and in general Islam is portrayed as a peaceful religion. Anything else?

• You may not know about Israel, but I do; and I am perplexed that notwithstanding Muslem hatred, that appears to be an intrinsic part of Islam, the Children of Israel are taught to respect differences; and respect for other's beliefs; including Muslems who are equal to Jews under the laws of the State of Israel. How about including the fact that Jews are not even permitted to enter this country; even though places like Medina were founded by Jews.

• Medina was not founded by Jews! Arab Pagans lived there long before Jews have.

• I am copying the following text, posted at the next section hereafter, to this section:

Israeli Text books (I am an Israeli Educator) tend to deal with Islam in a staight forward manner, dealing with historical developement, trends and natuarlly interaction with Jewish communities in Muslin countries, and a comparison between Judiaism and Islam. Over 20% of israelis are Muslims, and many Muslims work in the Israeli Ministry of Educationm, so there would be little point, interest nor opportunity to inclide hate literature in official studies or text books. While there are differences in textbboks for Arab and Jewish pupils (firstly becvause of the use of Hebrew or Arabic, secondly because of more emphasis and depth on Jewish, Christian, Muslim or Druse religious aspects, in relation to the specif needs of different pupil groups). Because it is in the interest of the people and the government that all of its citizens be able to live in harmony and mutual respect of others ideas, religeous beliefs and rights, it is only natural to stress the common aspects of our beliefs and history, and downplay the negative disrespective events that have occured. While extremist views are expressed in some situations by both sidesd, these are not part of any officially authorised texts or curricullums (I'm talking about the Israeli school system, as opposed to the Palestinian Authorities texts, some of which are donated by Saudi sources, and reflect those views). In the first years of Islam, it sems that the prophet Muhhamed assumed that the Jewish tribes in what is now Saudi Arabia would convert to Islam. Many Jewish tribes lived on the area of Mekkah and Medinah. When this did not occure Muslim leaders declared war / jihad against them. Eventually almost all Jews in the area were killed or converted. The only exceptions being Jews in Yemen, who were allowed, with certain restrictions to live peacefull and carry out their traditiopns both is religion and craft (Jewlers and traders) Since them, Jews in that area have been rare, and are officially band from entering all of Saudia Arabia, and not just the 2 holy cities. Israeli Muslims are allowed to make the Haj, but cannot carry Israeli Passports. One of the few recognized Jews to enter Saudi Arabia was Henry Kissenger, the US sec. of state at the time. American Jewish soldiers are not officially allowed (by the Saudis) to serve in the country, but the US armed forces do not report soldiers' religion (though there have been problems with the supply of Kosher food to them, especially on the Passover Holiday wjhich has many dietary restrictions).

Abu mohammed 05:17, 16 October 2006 (UTC) You jews like to play your game of changing facts. you always say what you won't do. I don't know where you got the idea that there were tribes of jews around makka. I know of our history more than you do. There were no jews around makka, there were some living around Madina and they made aggrement with prophet Mohammed to not help the pagans against Mohammed but " as always " they betray the prophet Mohammed in the battle of " Ahzab " and tried to help the pagans against him but the muslems discovered their betrayal. As a result some were exiled from Madina.[reply]

Yeah right, I was sitting in a class in Montreal, Canada, a city in a nation thats thought to be the most peacefull in the world. It was an International Economics class and the teacher was talking about Comperative Advantages in trade and such, so the teacher said who knows what Saudi Arabia would have an Advantage on, some student said "Oil and Natural Gasses" so the teacher said correct and carried on, I was sitting in the back and the kid infront of me whisperd to his girlfriend "yeah,, and terrorists", this was like a 19 year old kid, what do you think of that? --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 13:12, 20 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Comparison of various reputable sources for population estimates:

• UN Population Division: 24,573,100 (2005) / 25,192,720 (2006)
• Population Reference Bureau: 24,573,000 (2005)
• Saudi Arabia Census of 2004 (provisional results): 22,673,438
• World Gazetteer: 23,595,634 (2005-2006)
• CIA Factbook: 27,019,731

The CIA figure seems to overestimate the population compared to other sources. I think we should use the UN figures unless the CIA figure is corroborated by another official source. Polaron | Talk 21:40, 29 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

hmm,, well Saudi Arabia has a low avrage age, not because there are no old people but because there are many, many, many young people. So one year can make a one-two million and it's not getting lower (yet), so estimating can be really hard. I would say follow which ever one says (2006) but i know its not 23.9 mil, I would say 25-27 mil --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 04:04, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Israeli Text books (I am an Israeli Educator) tend to deal with Islam in a staight forward manner, dealing with historical developement, trends and natuarlly interaction with Jewish communities in Muslin countries, and a comparison between Judiaism and Islam. Over 20% of israelis are Muslims, and many Muslims work in the Israeli Ministry of Educationm, so there would be little point, interest nor opportunity to inclide hate literature in official studies or text books. While there are differences in textbboks for Arab and Jewish pupils (firstly becvause of the use of Hebrew or Arabic, secondly because of more emphasis and depth on Jewish, Christian, Muslim or Druse religious aspects, in relation to the specif needs of different pupil groups). Because it is in the interest of the people and the government that all of its citizens be able to live in harmony and mutual respect of others ideas, religeous beliefs and rights, it is only natural to stress the common aspects of our beliefs and history, and downplay the negative disrespective events that have occured. While extremist views are expressed in some situations by both sidesd, these are not part of any officially authorised texts or curricullums (I'm talking about the Israeli school system, as opposed to the Palestinian Authorities texts, some of which are donated by Saudi sources, and reflect those views). In the first years of Islam, it sems that the prophet Muhhamed assumed that the Jewish tribes in what is now Saudi Arabia would convert to Islam. Many Jewish tribes lived on the area of Mekkah and Medinah. When this did not occure Muslim leaders declared war / jihad against them. Eventually almost all Jews in the area were killed or converted. The only exceptions being Jews in Yemen, who were allowed, with certain restrictions to live peacefull and carry out their traditiopns both is religion and craft (Jewlers and traders) Since them, Jews in that area have been rare, and are officially band from entering all of Saudia Arabia, and not just the 2 holy cities. Israeli Muslims are allowed to make the Haj, but cannot carry Israeli Passports. One of the few recognized Jews to enter Saudi Arabia was Henry Kissenger, the US sec. of state at the time. American Jewish soldiers are not officially allowed (by the Saudis) to serve in the country, but the US armed forces do not report soldiers' religion (though there have been problems with the supply of Kosher food to them, especially on the Passover Holiday wjhich has many dietary restrictions).

The articles makes the following statement: "Many opponents of the House of Saud reject the family's legitimacy and decline to speak of the country as 'Saudi Arabia'." So, I was curious to know what they would call it? What are the alternative names for Saudi Arabia? I can understand if it's not really relevant or widely used that it shouldn't go into the article's text. But I'm very curious and think that this kind of trivia (if it is indeed "trivia") is always interesting to find at Wikipedia. Thanks!--Sir Edgar 05:16, 5 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Those who oppose the rule of House of Saud often identify themselves by their region or province, e.g. someone from Jeddah, Makkah or Madinah prefer to be known as a Hijazi rather than a Saudi. It's probably easy to assume the answer is simply "Arabia" (without the "Saudi") but the term is too generic, something that the mostly tribal-by-nature Saudis would not associate themselves with. South of the border, I personally knew someone from South Yemen who still does not think favourably of the reunification; he does not identify himself as Yemeni but a citizen of Hadhramaut.

The translation of the English name and Arabic name are not the same (Kingdom of Saudi Arabia (Arabic: المملكة العربية السعودية‎)). Is Saudi a kingdom or not? Kiumars 12:33, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yes it is a kingdom. "Arabia" (without the "Saudi") is one alternative name. Others sometimes refer to it as just "The Kingdom", or "Arabian Peninsula", or just "The Peninsula", or less commonly "Kingdom Arabia". Some who oppose the rule of House of Saud refuse to identify themselves as Saudis identify themselves as "Arabians" or identify themselves by their cities/villiges/tribes/region.

I came to the Saudi Arabia page to look for information on sports in Saudi Arabia, but was disappointed to find no mention of it. If some expert could shed light on the subject (what sports are popular, satdiums and clubs, regulation, women's sports), it would be greatly appreciated. Arnob 04:13, 10 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

hmm,,, the information you are looking for would be found at Category:Sport in Saudi Arabia, I guess we could add a section under culture --mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 04:30, 10 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

How is the nightlife in Saudi Arabia. Do they party all night long?--Comanche cph 18:04, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Saudis usually stay up long periods of time during vacations, even though there is very little entertainment, no movies or arcades or nothing! strange huh? I'm writing this at 5:15 am and I don't plan to sleep before 10. I woke up at 4pm today. Which is totally normal :). Burning phoneix 02:14, 15 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Somebody decided to remove my reference to public executions on the spurious grounds that it was an act of vandalism. I have restored the comment and added a reliable reference. I don't see any reason why it should be removed now - these public beheadings are one of the most outstanding examples of the Saudi's distance from the West, and they should not be hidden in the name of false political correctness.

It's not false political correctness as much as it is racist propaganda. First of all, the laws do exist, but the execution rate is low compared to countries such as China. Second, 80% of the executions in the world took place in China (http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/ENGACT500062006). The execution rate PER CAPITA in the US is THREE TIMES HIGHER than in both Iran and Saudi Arabia, according to this post. So yes, in five days I am going to delete this part because if we're going to pick on countries based on their human rights record, we should look at other countries first. However, if you want to keep this piece of propaganda, tell me so I can add these statistics.

Racist and propaganda are terms befitting an article which intentionally skews data for the expressed purpose of altering opinions. It is general knowledge that Saudi Arabia abides by sharia law, so it is intellectually correct to indicate what that entails. Chinese and US behaviour have no bearing on that. This is an international forum.

Without stating a personal view, I'll just say that it is widely held in Saudi Arabia that execution with a sword is a lot less painful and humiliating than Western methods. As for it being public, don't they provide rows of seats in the US to watch lethal injection executions? It's hard to condem one without also condeming the other.

Icut a lot of poorly written text which appears to be more like propaganda from the section of politics. Also, the section of economics had a well-written several paragraphs, followed by text which did not fit with the above and which was an amalgam of data, belonging to Economy of Saudi Arabia. I cut that one too.

I wonder if there are any comments on that. Thanks. Oleg Alexandrov (talk) 18:52, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

How can it be racist propaganda for not mentioning China or Iran in an article about Saudi Arabia??!?!?! Is it homophobic too because it doesn't mention homosexuality? I haven't looked at the pages for China, Iran or the US yet but I daresay contentious subjects like this will also be mentioned there. I shall have a look now...

Stable versioning is being tested on this article. This means that all editing will be made on Saudi Arabia/development, and on a regular basis, good edits will be moved onto the consensus page. If you disagree with the current version, please let me know. Ral315 (talk) 05:26, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

In which I mean to tell me about what kind of punishments do Women and Girls get in Saudi Arabia? Because I really what to know all about 'cause due to that it seems that it dosn't really describe Punishments as a sorta whole thing for the people in Saudi Arabia . Do they get the death Penalty or not? And do they get less harsher punishments or not? I just want to know all this and much more. Also is their much percent of murdur and/or crime victims that are female just like in some societies? And please answer too (quickly).

Women usually receive less or equal punishment than men but I have no idea about the female crime rate.Burning phoneix 21:32, 31 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Except for adultery of course.. ;) TastyCakes 20:07, 27 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"despite the fact that they have shipped over 6.2 trillion barrels of oil between 1980 and 2006"

6.2 trillion barrels is more oil than has been produced in the entire world since oil production began. This cannot possibly be correct. A rough estimate based on current production of about 10 Million barrels per day. 10M x 365 x 26 years = 94.9 Billion barrels.

I have started a stub that needs further elaboration.-- Lance ^talk 03:26, 11 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My contribution was removed without justification or comment. The article, in its present form, is patently unencyclopedic.Lance ^talk

It has been stated in the History section that a Saudi State was first established in 1750. Should the Establishment section of the Fact file have a slight change.

This article has been heavily vandalized. I'm not sure how to fix it because the problems are in the table of contents...it says "Land of the terrorists" in the html script for the page, an administrator should fix it!

Maybe i am missing something here but there is no such phrase in the whole article (including the html). -- Szvest 13:06, 6 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I just removed a little more. This article needs to be locked down! --Mcorazao 04:16, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I see we have some Saudis here, so I pray you won't mind if I ask a few questions. I've always wanted to visit Saudi (too bad about the 'no infidels in Mecca' thing; I'd love to see it) and I was wondering what part of the country our native chums would recommend. Riyadh is the capitol, but I hear Jeddah is a wee more liberal and open to foreigners. Basically, I would like to visit your lovely country without having my head sawn off by a bowie knife-wielding madman screaming "Allah Akbar!" Any tips? How would a 6'5 tall, white, blond, 23 year-old Irish-American young man fare in KSA?

About entry; I've heard that Jews and atheists cannot enter. I'm an atheist, but I was raised Christian (Roman Catholic, to be precise). Would it be possible for me to simply not bring up my atheism and enter the country as a lifelong nominal Catholic Christian? Roland Deschain 04:54, 17 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I am not a Saudi but spent some time there years ago for profesional reasons. I'll start with the entry visa. Carrying an Israeli passport would prevent you automatically from requesting a visa. You carry an American passport and not an atheist passport. So nothing to explain as long as you say that you are an American.

As for which places to visit, i'd recommend Jeddah and the Eastern region (i.e. Khobar in particular). There are many foreigners there as well so you don't have to panic thinking that your physical appearence would bring you troubles. Just be friendly and good luck.

P.S. Have a look at Category:Wikipedians in Saudi Arabia where you'd find a few natives and foreigners for more details. Szvest → ^{Wiki Me Up ®} 12:13, 17 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If you actually think that you will get your head chopped off, then I don't want you to go to Saudi Arabia--mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 15:11, 18 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• It's not that I think all (or even most) Saudis are like that, but it *does* happen on occasion, ie Paul Johnson. It's just that I look more "American" than average, and I wouldn't want my appearance to make me a target for some loon trying to score infidel brownie points. No offense, Mo, it's just that I've yet to travel to anywhere in the Middle-East (except for Dubai and KSA doesn't have the best reputation in the US. Roland Deschain 20:04, 18 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• • You're right, some Saudis aren't big fans of Americans, They like Canadians and Europeans. I brought some of my Canadian friends over to Riyadh and they loved it. You know what bro, Saudi Arabia is not really big on tourists, if you want to go somewhere nice, go to Dubai, United Arab Emirates, its full with Americans and all other nationalities, you will love it there.--mo-- (^Talk | _#info | ) 21:22, 19 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• Yeah, I've been to Dubai and it's great. I've always wanted to travel to Saudi Arabia because it's an epoch of culture and I've always been interested in Islam. Maybe I can visit some time in the future. Thanks for the info, anyway. Peace. Roland Deschain 08:36, 21 November 2006 (UTC

• I believe the only way I would be visiting there would be as a uniformed member of a US military force Scott S 04:40, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to! No tourist activities! Maybe this is why Saudis would not welcome you as they would do w/ Roland. It reminds me of the stupid propaganda of the actual US admin; Iraqis would welcome us w/ flowers. Good luck. -- Szvest ^{Wiki me up ®} 12:58, 11 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, that will greatly increase your chances of getting killed. :P Burning phoneix 10:30, 17 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's hard to know where to start with the above. Where do people get these strange ideas? There are tens of thousands of Brits and Americans living happily in Saudi Arabia. Mrhawley 13:30, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Major Vandalism Issues

It seems like whole sections of this article are completely destroyed by vandalism. Can someone please clean this up so that this is a credible article again? I would but I don't know enough about Saudi Arabia to completely change the sections, which looks like is what is needed.