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1 October 14  



1.1  Protecting a book  
13 comments  




1.2  53-foot semi-trailers  
5 comments  




1.3  different causes with confusing name  
4 comments  




1.4  business management  
7 comments  




1.5  Polo shirt  
13 comments  




1.6  Internet:The new GOD?  
31 comments  




1.7  Being Released From Prison  
7 comments  




1.8  PSAT question  
2 comments  




1.9  Lawyer  
9 comments  




1.10  Haiti  
3 comments  




1.11  Casino perks  
9 comments  






2 October 15  



2.1  Reconciling bills in US government.  
2 comments  




2.2  Afghanis  
4 comments  




2.3  Milk in a coolbag  
8 comments  




2.4  Not medical advice but question on why people use anal beads and safety  
8 comments  




2.5  Solar panel installation in maui  
8 comments  






3 October 16  



3.1  Location of Czech village Butterberg / Máselnik  
4 comments  




3.2  Entertainment Lawyer  
4 comments  




3.3  superstitions  
17 comments  




3.4  Bentham and Hooker  
3 comments  




3.5  Blocking calls to my landline phone  
8 comments  




3.6  Energy Drinks vs Coffee  
4 comments  




3.7  BBC radio archive  
2 comments  




3.8  Translation of the word "free"  
16 comments  






4 October 17  



4.1  i want to know some info. about Britanniya industry, taratola,kolkata  
2 comments  




4.2  Argument of silence (conspiracy theories)  
19 comments  




4.3  Social Security in the Untied States, and different costs of living  
5 comments  




4.4  Foreign taxi drivers in the US  
3 comments  




4.5  Working in the USA  
8 comments  




4.6  Who came up with 4 rings when you call someone to be acceptable  
15 comments  






5 October 18  



5.1  hand grenades  
11 comments  




5.2  Tanks Going Through Walls  
9 comments  




5.3  Vegetarianism and absolutism  
13 comments  




5.4  Ernesto "Che Guevara" - a legend - a myth - or a fact?  
5 comments  




5.5  Shinnecock Indian Nation  
2 comments  




5.6  Snoop dogg  
3 comments  






6 October 19  



6.1  What if WWII Did Not Occur?  
31 comments  




6.2  Free contract bridge software for Windows Mobile  
1 comment  




6.3  Sock puppetry  
6 comments  




6.4  Connect the following  
12 comments  




6.5  Portland, Maine and suburbs  
4 comments  






7 October 20  



7.1  Surrogacy  
3 comments  




7.2  Flushing water mains  
2 comments  




7.3  Compact Disks  
2 comments  




7.4  want a article on HOW MS -OFFICE USED IN BUSSINESS & INDUSTRY".  
3 comments  




7.5  London web cams  
















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< Wikipedia:Reference desk

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Content deleted Content added
Line 353: Line 353:

== Compact Disks ==

== Compact Disks ==

how did compact discs create new business opportunites? <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Christina hamby|Christina hamby]] ([[User talk:Christina hamby|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Christina hamby|contribs]]) 13:38, 20 October 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

how did compact discs create new business opportunites? <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Christina hamby|Christina hamby]] ([[User talk:Christina hamby|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Christina hamby|contribs]]) 13:38, 20 October 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


:What was before? Who bought them? What kinds of equipment (if any) were needed to go with them? What sales and manufacturing jobs were created? Think along those lines, and you will find the answers coming quickly.

:You have a brain. So, exercise it. It will help you in life and may even help avoid [[Alzheimer's Disease]] later.[[Special:Contributions/209.244.187.155|209.244.187.155]] ([[User talk:209.244.187.155|talk]]) 14:19, 20 October 2009 (UTC)



== want a article on ''HOW MS -OFFICE USED IN BUSSINESS & INDUSTRY". ==

== want a article on ''HOW MS -OFFICE USED IN BUSSINESS & INDUSTRY". ==


Revision as of 14:19, 20 October 2009

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October 14

Protecting a book

Many a time at school, I find myself with some time on my hands (anywhere from 5 to 50 minutes) in which I have absolutely nothing to do. Except...read! I'm enjoying some books from the school's library, and I take good care of them and whatnot. However, I have at least a dozen books of my own collection that I haven't read yet, and free reading at school would be a great way to work through them. There's just one problem; I'm the type of person who meticulously cares for his belongings. I always promptly return discs to their cases, I handle any sort of delicate electronic equipment with measured care...I don't even open my books much farther than 100 degrees, to prevent the spines from cracking. Yes, it is a bit ridiculous. ^_^

However, it would be a nightmarish...nay, impossible task to attempt taking one of my books to school without protection and preventing all sorts of damage. Even a minor scuff to the cover would be inexcusable to me. What would be a viable method of protecting a book to this extent? The only thing I can think of would be a small cardboard box, but I'd probably look silly carrying that around all the time, right? Perhaps I could stow it in my bookbag, but what if the weight of my textbooks crushed it? What to do, what to do?--The Ninth Bright Shiner 01:28, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If your books are hardcover, you may consider stretchable book covers. That would minimize scuffing. Falconusp t c 01:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not as meticulous as you but I generally throw my softcover books into a gallon size Ziploc bag and then toss that into my bookbag. Dismas|(talk) 01:50, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
...I know the answer you want isn't, "stop being so OCD," but seriously, books are meant to be read, and that means cracking the cover a bit, and that's OK, because it means you are actually using them. When I was very young, I used to avoid eating candies that were terribly pretty because it felt like it would destroy their aesthetics. Then one day I found that maggots had gotten a lot of them. After that I resolved to just use things as I saw fit—not trash them, mind you, but understand what they are for—and get the most out of them. A book is meant to be read. Unless you're talking about treasured, collectible keepsakes (which you shouldn't bring to school)... just read 'em! A weathered book is a good friend. They will last longer than you expect. --Mr.98 (talk) 02:10, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A bit of samurai wisdom from Hagakure: After reading books and the like, it is best to burn them or throw them away. Vranak (talk) 02:35, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I prefer to burn them before I read them. Bus stop (talk) 02:41, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Back in the olden days, before manufactured book covers existed (because 1950s parents wouldn't pay real money for them anyway), we made our own. Short of bending galvanized metal around your books, there was nothing that beat a book cover made from a plain old brown paper grocery bag -- especially if you could reinforce the corners with duct tape!
Paper grocery bags aren't as heavy today, so perhaps you could use two layers of brown bag. Alternatively, try to acquire a couple of manila file folders, and repurpose them to this task. Or, do you have a dog? Carefully cut open a dog food bag, flatten it, and use that multi-layer product to make a book cover which might also be mildly water-resistant.
(I guess it should be noted, in case it's not obvious, that this works best for hardcover books, not paperbacks.)
Good luck -- and have fun! -- with your project. --DaHorsesMouth (talk) 03:42, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Book stores used to sell book covers that you could wrap around the hard covers of books. There were even flexible vinyl covers to help protect paperbacks. The ziplock back (which of course didn't exist in my youth) is an excellent idea. Truth to tell, though, taking a special book to a public place...? Ask yourself if you could live without it, i.e. what you would do if it got stolen. Here's an idea: Keep a "good" copy stashed at home, and a "reading" copy with you, maybe a paperback version. Over time, you may discover you have more affection for the reading copy. However, if it gets stolen, you've got that other one. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 05:23, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Protect book covers with adhesive transparent foil (vinyl is better than ordinary sticky tape that in time turns brown). Your protected covers will be durable, can be cleaned with a damp sponge and keep their second-hand value. Alternatively consider taking off the dust covers (jackets) from hardcover books and keeping them in a safe place since they are relatively fragile. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 08:07, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Plastic covers are very common on library and school books. You could ask your school librarian where they get theirs or try your local office supplies superstore. AlmostReadytoFly (talk) 08:19, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
As for transporting them, I suggest investing in a hard-surface briefcase. Some are made of rigid plastic or other synthetic material, and I've even seen attorneys using metal (aluminum) briefcases. — Michael J 13:12, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm like you about my books :) I used to take books to school in a hard plastic pencil box, like a Spacemaker. This has the advantage of people thinking it's just a pencil box and not knowing you're actually being neurotic about the pristine condition of your books. Saves some ridicule :) (I know all about that firsthand.) Larger books probably won't fit, but my paperback copy of Lord of the Rings fit perfectly, so I was a happy kid. It prevents not only scuffs, but bent pages, spilled liquids, getting trompled by other things in your backpack, and all manner of other damage that bags and covers might not. And they can be obtained for about $3 at your local school supplies store. Cherry Red Toenails (talk) 03:31, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If you want to go to the extreme level of protecting paperback books, libraries use services such as Demco to do this. It's basically a plastic adhesive film that goes over the book. You buy a kit that comes with the film and some stuff to trim it to size. There is probably a more consumer oriented company around if you want to go this route, but it is more than you need if you don't plan on circulating your personal books. When ordering books in bulk (for a library), this type of covering is an option for something around $2 per book. You can also buy cloth book covers made for various sizes of books, though this probably isn't the cheapest option compared to using a book sized container. That said, I'm in the "abuse your books" camp. No point in having them if you spend more time keeping them in perfect condition than you do reading them! 206.131.39.6 (talk) 19:48, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

53-foot semi-trailers

In the U.S. of A., a couple of decades ago (maybe even post-1973 oil embargo), there was a wide-sweeping "reform" of interstate trucking regulations. I recall two features of the law, which affected the maximum size of semi-trailers: one for width, the other for length.

As a result, we have 53-foot trailers on the road today. Alone among semi-trailers, they are required to have their length displayed in large letters within a few feet of the front of the box.

Now, where the heck did 53 feet come from? I've pondered this at length, and my best idea is that it's the maximum length which can make a turn of some radius -- said radius being significant to road designers. But, that's just a wild guess.

Does anyone know the Real Truth of the matter? A good night's sleep depends on a credible answer! --DaHorsesMouth (talk) 03:26, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'll do some searching, but in the meantime, another factor is the size of a standard commercial pallet (40" x 48"). Having the internal length to be a number divisible by 48" would be a "good thing". I believe the 53' measurement in the external length; internal would be more like 51' - 52', which is divisible by 48". Matt Deres (talk) 04:00, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
One possible reason for such regulations on the dimensions of vehicles may be the need to ensure compatibility for truck-train combinations in shipping. The term in the US seems to be "intermodal". Clearly, trucks would have to follow certain dimensional standards to optimally fit onto the rolling stock available. --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 06:49, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
[1] seems to suggest that there's always (since the 1950s at least) been limits on vehicle sizes; the reason the current maximum is 53' is because a maker of 53' trailers actively lobbied to have the maximum size raised to that number. 53' is the maximum size of intermodal containers in the USA, although that's more likely a result of the trailer sizes rather than a cause. FiggyBee (talk) 15:36, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am dumbstruck or awestruck or whatever, and for two separate reasons:

Hats off to you all! --DaHorsesMouth (talk) 22:06, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

different causes with confusing name

It's understood KTWV released quite a few compilation albums. They each were called "Wave-Aid". Portions of the proceeds benefitted AmfAR. But I know there's a different WaveAid. That one was a benefit concert for the 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake relief efforts. What can be done to clear up this confusion?24.90.204.234 (talk) 04:19, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It appears to me that it's too late now; whoever was last should have named their effort something else. Since 99.99% of Earthlings have heard of neither effort, I doubt this is much of a problem, by the way. Whoever was interested in either cause will presumably find out quickly that they're investigating the wrong charity effort. Tempshill (talk) 04:25, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I believe you meant to say '99.99% of Earthlings outside of Asia' have never heard of either effort.' DOR (HK) (talk) 07:40, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There might be some bias in Tempshill's comment. However, the listed WaveAid says it raised 2 million dollars. That's not really a lot for something supposed to be significant. Live Aid raised like a hundred times that amount just on its first go-around. The Jerry Lewis MDA Telethon for that year raised 60 million dollars. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots08:03, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

business management

business management,

 can i know d advantages n disadvantages of control which is a managerial function????
      it is not a homework question.... its just for my reference

can u give more information about control which is one of d managerial function —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.96.205.120 (talk) 06:28, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

See the article Management which links to other management-related articles. Control is only one of the activities of a manager. Others are planning, organizing, staffing, leading and directing an organization or effort for the purpose of accomplishing a goal. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 07:48, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Accepting that this is not a homework question, it is however the same question as you asked 2 days ago. It is unlikely that you will get different answers this time. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 07:53, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Also, "just for your reference", the word "the" does not have a d in it. FiggyBee (talk) 15:39, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Also a good idea, for a manager or anyone else, to spell "and" as "and", or "&". --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 21:43, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I would just like to note that the OP's IP address resolves to India, where English is commonly spoken, but is not a native language, so maybe some slack could be cut. Just a suggestion.-- Александр Дмитрий (Alexandr Dmitri) (talk) 08:36, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That "d" is not a spelling error or other 'non-native speaker mistake', it's IM talk (like "dat" for "that"). No slack necessary. rʨanaɢ talk/contribs 08:18, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Polo shirt

I've just had a haircut. At my school, students must wear polo shirts in terms 1 and 4. I hate wearing polo shirts because they are itchy (even itchier when I've just had a haircut). What's a good way to remove itchiness from polo shirts? jc iindyysgvxc (my contributions) 09:40, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fabric softener? Also, I'm guessing that the shirts have to be of a certain color or have some other restriction like that. Is there a way to get the required color or whatever in a cotton shirt? Cotton may be less itchy to you than synthetic fibers. Dismas|(talk) 10:40, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You may also want to try a different laundry detergent - some people are irritated by certain types of detergent (eg. bio vs non-bio). I would expect that to make any shirt itch (and other clothing), but it might still be worth a try. --Tango (talk) 12:05, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am not sure but try dry cleaning.Adi4094 (talk) 10:43, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Dry cleaning a cotton polo shirt is usually not a good idea... --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 11:37, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Several washes will do the trick, but age the shirt.86.200.134.121 (talk) 14:08, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If the school requires this type of "uniform", perhaps they would have some suggestions about how to fix this problem. If their answer is "tough it out", maybe you should go to a different school. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 17:58, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, very helpful BB, as always —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.4.186.107 (talk) 18:33, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Why should he have to put up with something uncomfortable? →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 03:03, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Why not answer a question with a reference instead of making flippant comments? Malcolm XIV (talk) 12:47, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Why are you constantly trying to keep the ref desks in a box? The questioner is asking how to put up with something. I'm asking why do you have to?Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 13:06, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Undershirt? -- Coneslayer (talk) 19:08, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If we're not talking about a school uniform (you don't specify.), you could just get different polo shirts. They're not all made from the same material. APL (talk) 02:48, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Internet:The new GOD?

I saw a doomsday documentary on the History channel.It says Internet is equivalent to God.It can make certain predictions. How does this theory work?It was just mentioned not explained.Adi4094 (talk) 10:37, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How should we know? You are the one that watched the documentary. It sounds like a reference to the wisdom of crowds. I think there is more to being a god than precognisance, though... --Tango (talk) 10:50, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"If one could conclude as to the nature of the Creator from a study of creation, it would appear that God has an inordinate fondness for cats and pirates." --Mr.98 (talk) 13:20, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The internet can also change reality by making certain things true or false. DJ Clayworth (talk) 13:22, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, and if you wanted to extend it further... it tells us how things are ordered, you can make a plea to it and maybe it will respond (and maybe it won't)... and.. yeah. I don't know. It's a little crackpot. If it is a God, it is not a Christian God, it is more like one of the Greek gods, who is occasionally shagging a sheep and all that. --Mr.98 (talk) 13:24, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That would explain why it doesn't always respond very quickly. DJ Clayworth (talk) 16:11, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If you want to get into the church of the high technological, I recommend reading about the technological singularity, which is a far more far-out concept than saying the Internet is God (which is intellectually rather shallow). --Mr.98 (talk) 13:26, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I looked at the first two results in this google search and they seem like they might be relevant. If not, you'll have to give us more details. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 13:27, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Television was once similarly described, in that it could reach everyone at once, or at least everyone who was tuned in to it. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 14:09, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well I've heard it said that God is truth. So insomuch as the internet spreads truth, it could be described in divine terms. Or we could just be a little more plain-spoken and say that the Internet is pretty nifty. Vranak (talk) 15:24, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Insomuch as the internet spreads truth..." is a bit like saying "Insomuch as Ann Coulter is a liberal...". DJ Clayworth (talk) 16:13, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well Wikipedia is pretty good when it comes to accurate information, I think. If we talk about most anything outside Wiki... you're right. Sports scores, that's spot on. Vranak (talk) 16:51, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Wikipedia is pretty good when it comes to accurate information", haha! What a comedian! Adam Bishop (talk) 17:22, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I am disturbed by your apparent lack of faith! Well, no... not really. :) Vranak (talk) 18:18, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I can see both sides of that question. Mostly, the info in our articles happens to be accurate; it'd be a damn poor show if that were not the case. But WP does not focus on "the truth" per se of a subject. It focuses on what information can be verified from reliable sources. Big difference, but with, hopefully, a big overlap. -- JackofOz (talk) 03:18, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
To "verify" means to "make true". →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 03:36, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Not around here; see Wikipedia:Verifiability, not truth. -- JackofOz (talk) 03:41, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
An editor can assert something as being true, thinking we're supposed to take his word for it because he and all his friends "know" it's true (a frequent problem on wikipedia); or he can find a citation and "make it true" under wikipedia standards. Verification is needed for facts that are not universally or substantially obvious. You can say "Barack Obama is male", and demanding a citation for that would be silly. But a statement about his height and weight would require a citation. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 03:49, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
None of which makes it necessarily "true" that he's whatever height we say it is. All that's true is that some reputable sources say he's that height. We accept the word of reputable sources; but reputable sources have been known to be wrong. We allow for that possibility when we make no claim that any of the facts presented in WP are "true"; all we ever claim is that they've been verified. Calling this "true under Wikipedia standards" is a distortion of the meaning of the word "true". -- JackofOz (talk) 05:44, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
And that argument likewise distorts the meaning of "verify". Here's the deal: "Truth" can be a relative concept. To "make true" in the wikipedia sense means to make the facts "as true as we can", although the "absolute" truth may be uncertain. We do not blindly accept sources if it's obvious that they're wrong, because that would be an insult to our readers. If the only source for Obama's height said he was 4 feet tall, we couldn't use that, regardless of what the source was. And we have to use some editorial judgment when supposedly reliable sources provide conflicting information. An example of the latter was discussed recently in regard to the ballplayer Dave Kingman and comments that an opposing manager, Tommy Lasorda, made about Kingman, back in the 1970s. Some logic and reason had to be applied to provide the "true" answer. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 06:21, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I fail to see the analogy. No god in human history ever made predictions as far as I know. Among other things, making any kind of predictions would imply they were not in control. --KageTora - SPQW - (影虎) (talk) 16:50, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Matthew 26:34 is one example that comes to mind immediately: "Truly, I say to you, this very night, before the cock crows, you will deny me three times." Malcolm XIV (talk) 09:11, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm constantly getting yelled at for making "unhelpful" responses. The fact is that Tango's initial response was sarcastic, pointed, and totally fitting. The OP asks us to interpret a TV show that he just watched. How silly is that? There needs to be an approved procedure for simply saying, "Sorry, can't help you. See ya." →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 17:37, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ok now you challenged me to actually give a thoughtful response.
What I'm getting from the original question is akin to the typical doomsday sci-fi scenario, ala Skynet. When people start putting together a large scale network with some AI capabilities, something interesting happens and we can either get large-scale malice, or as the OP says, we might be able to get some useful predictions. Well, the way computers work is like this: they are very good at doing specifically what you instruct them to. When it comes to extreme high-level functions like predicting the future -- well that's just a non-starter. Computers are very very dumb. If you can make a machine to see into the future, you can already do so yourself. That is my understanding. Vranak (talk) 19:03, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You might be interested in Saint Vidicon. Who then was a gentleman? (talk) 20:46, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Gods usually evoke worship. Who, pray tell, worships the Internet? →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 03:37, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The Internet Prayer Verily I bowest before thy shrine of 102 buttons and do invoke thy mysterious spirit by pressing thy holy button, that button not of the 102, even that button of which Saint Gates commanded Thou shall not press a second time for they that seek to End shall pray to Start. Blessed be thy infinite network for its packets bring me comfort and I shall surf in its bandwidth forever. Give us this day our chat, our mail and our porn in abundance, for now we see as through windows dimly the great domain of thy name sung by 32 angels but we rest in faith that soon at the last bugfix of the last glitch there shall be no more workarounds and a vista made mightier seven-fold by a chorus of 128 angels shall be our reward. E-men. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 18:09, 15 October 2009 (UTC) [reply]

Maybe it is?http://www.roma1.infn.it/~anzel/answer.html..Hotclaws (talk) 17:32, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Good Question! Let's ask Multivax. APL (talk) 14:57, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A late response, but we _do_ have an article on this particular issue - Web Bot. It's supposed to have predicted 9/11, and the end of the world on October 29th 2009 - viz, the Thursday after next. I hope everyone has made appropriate preparations... Tevildo (talk) 23:03, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
October 25th (next Sunday), my apologies. Tevildo (talk) 23:06, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Being Released From Prison

When a prisoner is released from prison, do they arrange anything for them like sort of a halfway house or anything? Just curious, I always see that in movies where the gates open, they walk out and then they close... but I wasn't sure how the system really works. Do they arrange anything at all? Because some might not have family and obviously no job or home, especialy in the winter months.74.218.50.226 (talk) 14:51, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What jurisdiction are you thinking of? Here in the UK the prison will issue a "Get you home" travel warrant plus a Discharge Grant (not very much). If the prisoner is being released early for good behaviour reasons, he/she will have been assessed as being capable of surviving on release, and if not, there will be some form of Social Work intervention, failing which, there may be a half-way house arrangement - but not always. Prisoners MAY NOT be kept incarcerated beyond their ultimate sentence duration in any circumstances. 92.23.90.16 (talk) 15:18, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In the UK, prisoners can specify where they would like to be released to (e.g. to stay with a friend or relative or a halfway house). There's then a decision made as to whether that is possible, and whether it will be permitted. Shelter give advice to people in this situation and try to find suitable accommodation for those who need it. Warofdreams talk 15:48, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If you are released on parole then I believe your parole officer is responsible for helping you settle into your life as a free person. There will be systems in place to help them do that. --Tango (talk) 15:58, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
For better or worse, many U.S. states and the U.S. Federal government have abolished much of the former parole system in favor of fixed sentences, so I think there are fewer parole officers, at least by that name. (They still have probation officers, who enforce the provisions of a probation sentence.) There's also been a philosophical shift towards deterrence, punishment (retribution) and incapacitation, and away from reform and rehabilitation, as ends of a criminal sentence. But there must be some system governing early release. —— Shakescene (talk) 05:17, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Things are similar to the UK in NZ I believe. For example, in some cases finding a suitable place for you to live is necessary before parole will be granted. Help will be offered to those who can't find one. [2] Nil Einne (talk) 11:34, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]


We have an article: Halfway house -- 128.104.112.179 (talk) 22:09, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

PSAT question

What are some of the questions highlighted with a blue box on the answer sheet, while others are not/Accdude92 (talk) (sign) 17:09, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Unless it's predictable (i.e. every 5 questions are highlighted in a different colour), then it probably only means something to the people who wrote the test.
If you are referring to highlighting similar to [3] , I believe it is only to assist in page orientation for the student. You can contact PSAT directly at: psathelp@info.collegeboard.org. --Preceding unsigned comment 02:26, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lawyer

What do I do If I hired a lawyer to do a job and it took so long for them to get it done (not due to a deadline) Just took too long I had to hound them many times. It has caused me severe financial hardship

help09 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 20jump02 (talkcontribs) 17:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In the first instance, complain to the lawyer themselves. If that doesn't work, you can probably complain to the local bar or similar - where are you? --Tango (talk) 17:47, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Missouri. Whats complaining going to do Ive done that already manytimes thats the only reason they got anything done.this has stressed me out alot.they are getting it done now(I hope) !!!! Its to late to start over i spent to much time already with them, do I just take this bull sh... and know never to use them again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 20jump02 (talkcontribs) 18:12, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that complaining to the offending party is unlikely to do much good. If you think that the lawyer has violated ethical standards, you could complain to the Missouri Bar association. If you think that he or she has violated any laws, you could hire a different lawyer (after getting references) and press charges against your former lawyer. Other than that, you could always look for forums online where you can describe your experiences with this lawyer to try to warn others that they may risk the same. Marco polo (talk) 18:27, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The applicable term for "lawyer did not appropriately fulfill his professional obligations to a client" is malpractice, specifically legal malpractice. But note that not all "lawyer didn't do what they were supposed to" situations rise to the level of malpractice. -- 128.104.112.179 (talk) 22:07, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I think it depends on the circumstances. For example with a large law firm, they may have a system in place where they will take on complaints. Depending on the circumstances, they may not necessarily take action, but if they get frequent complaints about a certain lawyer this is unlikely to be favourable to said lawyer. Even if it's not a large law firm but is a firm with multiple lawyers involved and if your case isn't very serious, I would expect there's someone higher up in the law firm then your lawyer. Also it's not entirely clear how the existing complaints were handled. If you're just calling the lawyer involved in your cases (or their secretary/paralegal) and asking them to hurry up, while this may be an appropriate way to try and get them to hurry up, it's not necessarily a great way to actually issue a complaint. Note that if you want to take a complaint to someone else, it's usually a very good idea to show you've tried all resonable measures to resolve this directly with the people directly first. Nil Einne (talk) 11:49, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Keep in mind that your opinion of "how long something should take" may not be realistic. When I worked as a paralegal, we often had clients furiously enraged that (for instance) a transfer of land took more than a few hours to register at the land titles office. That was completely out of our hands, though: if the provincial land titles office took nine days to register a transfer, it took nine days. Yet the clients would be calling and calling, complaining and complaining, and refusing to believe that we couldn't somehow make things happen more quickly and blaming us for the delay. (Worse were the new homeowners who thought they could sign the documents on the day they moved in because that was how it was done on American TV: no, the documents have to be registered first, so you'd better sign them ten or fifteen days before the official closing date.) --NellieBly (talk) 15:20, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
For the record, it's also how it's done in American real life. We spent an hour or two at the lawyer's office signing the paperwork at closing, then drove directly to our new home and moved in. -- Coneslayer (talk) 18:34, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Concur Googlemeister (talk) 19:19, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Haiti

Okay my fiance' has a child that lives with its mother in Haiti. He is not being well taken care of, what are the child custody laws in Haiti so that i can help get my fiance' his son back and i can adopt him?!? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.65.191.34 (talk) 18:44, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia cannot give legal advice. Sorry. Xenon54 / talk / 18:51, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

But we can be a little more helpful. Search on google for 'Haiti custody law' or 'haiti custody lawyers' and follow the links - as noted you'll need to get legal guidance (something we can't provide you) but a bit of searching may find you an avenue 'in' to contacting someone who can provide more info. This result (http://www.hg.org/law-firms/Child-Support-and-Custody/Haiti.html) for instance appears to have a link to a view Haiti based lawyers that will help with child support / custody. ny156uk (talk) 20:26, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Casino perks

Quite often in movies that involve gambling at casinos (e.g. Rounders and 21) some character will say that they were "comped". I take this to mean that they got a complimentary stay at the casino hotel, dinner at a restaurant, etc. How often does this actually happen and what's the process? Do casino staff just wander around and hand out slips of paper saying that whoever presents the slip to another staff member gets whatever they got comped for? Does this just happen with people who are winning (to maybe entice them to stay longer and thus lose their money back to the casino?) or can you just be wandering through the casino and be 'comped'? Dismas|(talk) 19:48, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Accoutring to our article Comps (casino), it seems the more you play, the more "Comps" you get. Fribbler (talk) 20:01, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I should have known that we'd have an article on that... Dismas|(talk) 20:34, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You should read this article about government-owned casinos in Canada using so-called perks to lure compulsive gamblers into spending their life savings on blackjack and poker. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 22:47, 14 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The only comps that you can get just by showing up and looking interested are free drinks, in my experience. You really don't have to play much at all to get those -- you just have to be with someone who is playing. Considering it costs them almost nothing to provide the drinks, even with a large percentage of non-spenders getting them, it's not very surprising. --Mr.98 (talk) 14:51, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Unless you're a high roller, you generally have to ask for a comp (other than drinks of course). They then check out your "action" on their computer (tracked by the player's card you either place in a slot machine or present to a dealer at a table game before you start playing) to see how much you've played to decide if you warrant it. It's no big secret how they determine what you're worth to them. Basically, they calculate your expected loss (not your actual win or loss) and "rebate" you a percentage of that in comps. AFAIK, it doesn't matter if you're winning or losing. I believe that Jean Scott, the "Queen of comps", states that you can get the most comps for the least amount of $$$ by playing video poker (if you learn the right strategy). Clarityfiend (talk) 20:36, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Someone I know got offers in the mail, but I think it involved some king of registration as well as spending big in the casino. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 21:05, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yet another way that comps work, or worked a decade ago: When you sat down at a game table, you gave your club card to the dealer, who swiped it -- "logged you in", effectively. When you left the table, same procedure. Thus, they build up a history of your visit.
When you check out of the hotel, they look at your history vs your bill, and credit off some portion of it -- up to and including 100%.
One consequence of this program is you're more likely to do all your gambling in the one hotel/casino you're staying in, rather than hop around from one to the next to the next to the next. --DaHorsesMouth (talk) 22:15, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It used to be that most casino comping depended on the pit boss noticing you and offering you a comp. Now, most Vegas casinos offer "comp cards" which like credit cards you swipe when you sit down at a slot machine; many table games also have swiping machines; you hand your card to the dealer/croupier, who swipes it for you. The machine then automatically calculates your comp based on the betting level of the machine/game and how long you play it. The card then stores this comp as a "cash value" which can be spent anywhere in the hotel like cash; you could spend it on a room, in a shop, in a restaurant, etc. --Jayron32 02:22, 16 October 2009 (UTC) PS. Looks like DaHorsesMouth just said exactly that. I should prolly read ALL the comments. --Jayron32 02:30, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]


October 15

Reconciling bills in US government.

I've been following the progress of the health-care bill(s) through the US government - and we're now at the point where (according to NPR) they are attempting to 'merge' or 'reconcile' various bills that have already been passed by one or the other elected branch - plus those voted on by some committees. Do both houses then go and re-vote on the merged bill? I kinda got the impression from the radio report that the merged bill would merely go to presidential signature/veto - and that's that. That doesn't sound right to me - what exactly is the procedure? Who decides how to cherry-pick bits of one bill and bits of the other? SteveBaker (talk) 00:45, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

See Conference committee. And, yes, there is a re-vote, as described in United States congressional conference committee. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots 00:52, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Afghanis

In the 20th century many powers have tried to control Afghanistan.The British,Soviets failed.It looks like US is failing.Where do they get so much willpower,knowing that the invaders are much superior? US helped them fight the Soviets,but why the Afghanis wanted to fight them in the first place? Even before US assistance? They fired at Soviet helicopters with WW2 guns.Where does this exceptional courage come from? Is it in their genes? Or are they simply freedom loving people?Are they determined to cause the invaders damage,if only a little?Adi4094 (talk) 04:16, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well you oversimplify things. The British outright lost the first war, but from most perspectives won the second and third under their new assumption that they didn't want to control Afghanistan so much as they wanted to keep it as a buffer between the Russian Empire (later the USSR) and British India. These were not large wars, by any means. The Soviet invasion was repulsed, but only with the support of America, as well as India and many Muslim countries. Does the social make-up of Afghanistan make it an especially difficult place to "conquer"? Probably, the isolated, tribal, traditional culture all lends itself to fighting "outsiders". But I would argue no more so than other places in the world, which didn't fare so well against recent invaders. Indeed, Afghanistan hasn't fared that well if you look back through its history. I would say the biggest difficulties for would be invaders is the remoteness, the extremely difficult terrain and the lack of political will to properly support an invasion (due to the fact that it isn't a particularly useful piece of land). Second to all of that is "innate Afghan courage". I also think it is bordering on inflammatory to suggest the Taliban was a "freedom loving" government. TastyCakes (talk) 05:15, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The reason the forces there at the moment are struggling is because they are trying to fight the Taliban while not harming the innocent population. If they were willing to harm the general population they could win in a few days, but it would be a serious moral problem and they would be left with a complete mess - a completely failed and likely depopulated country which would result in lots of people turning to crime in the same way as lots of people from Somalia have turned to piracy causing a big problem for the rest of the world and other people moving there to use if for crime, eg. the growing poppies. The invading forces would be left having to occupy and police the whole country themselves without any cooperation from the local people (people don't usually cooperate with you after you kill large numbers of their friends and families). So, due to the moral and practical problems, it has been decided that the forces should protect the local people, not fight them, which makes it very difficult to defeat the Taliban. --Tango (talk) 09:42, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In premodern times, empires expanded simply by winning battles and killing or capturing opposing leaders. Ordinary people in conquered regions typically didn't care much who their master was, as long as he didn't greatly increase their burden. Thus what is now Afghanistan formed part of a variety of empires through history. In early modern times, empires were able to expand while greatly increasing the burden on ordinary people (through colonization, taxation, exploitation, etc.), because the imperialists enjoyed overwhelming technological advantages, such as (early) modern firepower, cavalry in regions that lacked it, and transoceanic navigation. Also, early modern imperialists succeeded in coopting local elites with various inducements. Since the 19th century, the calculus has changed with the rise of nationalism and the diffusion of modern weaponry. Short of blasting a place into ruins and committing something close to genocide, as Tango points out, it is exceedingly difficult for an outside power to subdue a country whose inhabitants are motivated by a nationalistic passion to resist external control. Nationalistic passion or something like it is now nearly universal, no less so in Afghanistan. As Tasty Cakes points out, Afghanistan resisted conquest in the early modern period because there wasn't much there to attract imperialists. The British probably could have subdued the country in the 19th century, but the lack of valuable commodities would not have justified the expense. It was enough to get the ruling elite to agree to help deter the Russians. Ruling elites and their people are no longer so amenable to taking the dictates of outsiders. Marco polo (talk) 14:36, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Milk in a coolbag

Is it possible to keep milk in a coolbag if said coolbag is frequently topped up with those gel coolpack thingies or ice or something? Will this work like a fridge of sorts? Thanks :) 129.67.144.173 (talk) 09:46, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, that will work fine. --Tango (talk) 10:08, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you can keep it cool - sure it'll work. Easiest way to tell milk has gone off? A quick smell, a little sip and (if necessary) a quick spit of it into the sink as there's little worse than gone-off milk for unpleasantness of flavour! 194.221.133.226 (talk) 10:11, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent, thanks a lot :) 129.67.144.173 (talk) 10:13, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
... and if you don't have a coolbag or fridge or access to ice etc, another way to keep milk cool is in a dish of cold water covered with a damp cloth. Dry air and a breeze speeds evaporation of the water, and this cools the milk (because the latent heat of evaporation has to come from somewhere). This method can work surprisingly well in some conditions. Dbfirs 18:24, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Two warm milk bags have double the charm. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 15:35, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

These cuddly vandalists should follow Wikipedia's rules and avoid vandalism. --71.111.194.50 (talk) 21:32, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
^^^^^ Sense of humour failure me thinks... Gazhiley (talk) 08:21, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not medical advice but question on why people use anal beads and safety

You would think that given the length of the anal beads pictured in that article, they could go quite far in, possibly get trapped, cause some damage? Kinda sick when you think about it. I can't believe people use these without thinking that it's gonna get trapped in their intestines.--Fillchugg (talk) 18:17, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Was there something hard to understand in the article you have seen where it says "Those who use anal beads enjoy the pleasurable feeling they receive" ? Do you have a question we can answer? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 18:29, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The rectum is about 12cm long. There is no scale in those pictures, but they don't look that long. --Tango (talk) 18:31, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The body apparently has little problem expelling things from its nether regions that are unwanted. I would liken the situation to getting food stuck in your throat. It may stay there for hours, even days, but eventually it does spontaneously move out. At least that is my speculation on the matter. I have no personal experience with anal beads, let me just state that up front. Vranak (talk) 19:55, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That's not at all true. The rectum is not suited to expelling anything other than soft stool, and those who use items for anal stimulation that are not intended for that purpose (curtain rings, billiard balls, marbles, vaginal vibrators, strings of pearls) frequently end up having to visit their doctor for an uncomfortable extraction. It's for this reason that sex toys that are designed for the anus have a facility either for easy removal (anal beads always have a lengthy string) or a mechanism to avoid total ingestion (butt-plugs have a wide base, many anal balls or beads have a collar on the distal end of their string). Without these the toy can become trapped, causing total de-facto constipation, which (if left unchecked, as someone might be tempted to do, given the embarrassing fix they've gotten themselves into) can lead to very serious complications. 87.114.150.241 (talk) 21:09, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
87.114 has it. As far as safety is concerned, toys designed for anal pleasure are quite safe when used according to instruction. The risks involved, besides accidental complete insertion, are tearing from using a sharp object, from rough insertion or from lack of lubrication; introduction of bacteria, viruses, etc. from unclean objects; and muscle fatigue from over-stretching. Despite this, when done carefully, anal play isn't inherently unsafe. It is not, however, fun for everyone, and should only be done consensually, of course. If you don't like it - don't do it. Steewi (talk) 23:40, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
As for why one might do it? In men, at least, the enjoyment comes from the combination of stimulation of the nerves around the rectal cavity and the sphincter and more importantly from the stimulation of the prostate, which is a very sensitive body part. Although it is mostly practiced by bisexual and homosexual men, many heterosexual men enjoy anal stimulation. Because they do not necessarily enjoy the stimulation of another man, the stimulation can be created with toys like anal beads. Steewi (talk) 23:44, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Anal beads normally have a ring to allow you to pull them out203.214.104.166 (talk) 11:30, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Solar panel installation in maui

My question is.... how to find due south in maui? how many degrees & what direction we need to comepnsate for our earths magnetic pull? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Elenao.q (talkcontribs) 19:14, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

See Magnetic Declination. PhGustaf (talk) 20:10, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Magnetic declination can be found on many sorts of maps, particularly nautical charts. A local navigational facility such as an airport can probably tell you (this data from 1985 says that it was 12E, though that may have shifted by now). Alternately, a non-magnetic means of determining direction (such as GPS) will give you true readings. I'd bet that 12E is close enough for jazz, though. — Lomn 20:12, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Or you could use a solar compass, look at the shadow of a vertical marker at local time noon (adjust your timezone for your longitude on the earth). After all it will be the sun position that is important. If this is worth tens of thousands of dollars use a surveyor. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 20:55, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]


It's probably not that critical. A fixed solar panel is always a compromise because the sun moves across the sky and that track shifts through the year - so your panel won't ever be perfectly oriented. Furthermore, the amount of sunlight the panel gets is proportional to the cosine of the angle between the direction it's pointed and the sun's direction and so a small error has almost no effect - even around noon. I'd use a compass and go with that. More important than the southerly alignment is the slope of the thing. SteveBaker (talk) 20:59, 15 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you’re actually in Maui, call up your address on Google maps, and you’ll have a North-South orientation. Find a landmark due south of where you are, and go outside and look for it. DOR (HK) (talk) 08:09, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Airport navigation charts are a good source for magnetic variation. The current FAA chart for Kahului Airport shows that Runway 02 has a compass heading of 024 degrees magnetic which is 035 degrees true. So there are 11 degrees difference between magnetic and true headings. A compass heading of 169 degrees would be due south. -- Flyguy649 talk 18:01, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Find Polaris in the night sky. It should be at an azimuth elevation of about 21 degrees. South will be directly behind you. Or get a cheap compass - this site [[4]] suggests your declination is 9 degrees 55 minutes East. Weepy.Moyer (talk) 18:53, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]


October 16

Location of Czech village Butterberg / Máselnik

I am searching for the exact geographical location of Butterberg (German) / Máselnik (Czech), a (possibly abandoned) village in the northern Bohemian county of Dauba / Dubá, classified as a part of the town of Sebitsch (German) / Dřevčice (Czech). Thus far, via google maps, I've been able to find a small collection of app. 8 houses just southwest of Dřevčice, which could be it.Butterberg (talk) 01:12, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You seem to have found the correct location. According to this historic map, the former Butterberg is indeed that cluster of houses on the hill about 500 meters southwest of Dřevčice. Marco polo (talk) 02:07, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Wow, that's an amazing web utility. I'd love to see that for my country (or any place I've actually been to). Jørgen (talk) 08:48, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well I am truly astonished. Thank you so much for the response. I didn't expect to get a quicker answer from my English query than from my German one, that's for sure.Butterberg (talk) 10:05, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Entertainment Lawyer

where can i find an entertainment lawyer —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.45.210.81 (talk) 02:25, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Try your local phone book. If you can't find one, call another lawyer and they may be able to point you in the right direction. Dismas|(talk) 03:14, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Contact your local bar association or law society - their website may have a directory with specialties as well. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 03:55, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Do they maybe advertise in Variety (magazine)? Also, typing in "Entertainment Lawyer" into Google caused a large number of them to scurry out of the woodwork. SteveBaker (talk) 13:20, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

superstitions

can anyone tell me which is the most superstitious country (and also the least)? is there any survey about this? please inform me.

thanx —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.50.136.193 (talk) 02:43, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This sounds like an impossible to answer question. On the first, what constitutes a superstition? How does one draw the line between a superstition and a religious practice? I'm not sure this is a quantifiable concept. --Jayron32 02:54, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There is no straightforward answer, as these days the people of any country have less and less in common with each other and more in common with their peers in other countries. There is no doubt some correspondence with lack of education, so you could try investigating that aspect. Also, if you believe that religion is superstition you could try looking at the more religious countries. I suspect that isolated communities would tend to have more superstitious ideas and traditions than urban ones.--Shantavira|feed me 08:01, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Arguably Italy, in that it has the most churches per capita of any major country.[5] Red Act (talk) 10:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Surprised nobody mentioned Vatican City yet... ~ Amory (utc) 13:17, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Or arguably Jamaica. I can't find a reliable online source, but googling "churches per capita" turns up a lot of hits that claim that the Guinness Book of World Records lists Jamaica as being the country with either the most churches per capita, or the most churches per square mile. Red Act (talk) 10:40, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
According to The Largest Atheist / Agnostic Populations the 10 most superstitious countries are Croatia followed by Cuba, Dominican Republic, Kyrgystan, Argentina, Albania, USA, Portugal, Mongolia, Kazakhstan. Dmcq (talk) 11:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It seems even with their low numbers atheists are to blame for all the ills of America - see Glenn Beck blames godlessness for America's problems ;-) Dmcq (talk) 11:34, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That would only be accurate if atheists and agnostic people were not superstitious - there are plenty of non-religious superstitions out there. Warofdreams talk 11:34, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It wouldn't make too much difference to that list if the percent of professed agnostics and atheists who are really closet believers in superstitions is less than 50%. Dmcq (talk) 11:50, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Do you have any references for that? Warofdreams talk 12:18, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If you look at that list they only get to about 10% atheist with those. No 20 in the list gets up to 20% atheists, even if all the next 10 were 50% closet believers and the 10 I said weren't the US at 7 place would only move down a few places in the list, it is given as 3-9% atheist. AT the other end of the spectrum are places like Sweden or Japan where more than half the population are counted as atheists. Dmcq (talk) 14:22, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Further to that, the list would still be accurate if the proportion of atheists who are superstitious is stable across countries. For example, if 99% of atheists are superstitious in all countries, that ranking won't change. Zain Ebrahim (talk) 11:56, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, but that's a big if. Superstitions, it seems to me, are based in culture - so there's every reason to expect variation. Warofdreams talk 12:18, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
How about CongoorHaiti? Witchcraft is not irregular in those places if I am not mistaken. I really wonder if I should offer any opinion at all, but I wonder if Japan is the least superstitious. They seem to generally have sane heads and sound minds. Vranak (talk) 15:32, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Japanese superstitions and also Omamori perhaps. While the Japanese evidentially don't skip the number 4 in floors as is not uncommon among Chinese and Koreans they do skip the number 43 in maternity rooms (according to the first article). According to the second article they also skip the number 13 in hotels although you could argue that isn't because the Japanese themselves are superstitious but they are afraid Western tourists may be. I largely agree Shantavira. In particular, there's likely to be some (imperfect) correlation with education. Going by stuff like the number of churches is not going to work, there are plenty of superstitions not tied with organised religions. Thinking of Chinese cultures... I've already mention stuffed like tetraphobia but there's also other stuff tied to numbers like the belief the number 8 is lucky (remember the olympics?). There's also feng shui, stuff tied to veneration of the dead and beliefs in the afterlife, during the Chinese New Year and various other superstitions. Doesn't appear to be a general article but there is an unsourced one on that which I'm also more familiar with which is Superstitions of Malaysian Chinese. Quite a few of these are probably present in parts of China. Traditional matchmaking and astrology are also not uncommon and usually have some sort of superstitious aspect. Some of these may have been traditionally discouraged by the communist government particularly during the cultural revolution but there's obviously some acceptance even by the government, e.g. the olympics again. And perhaps a key point here. Quite a few of these beliefs are not uncommon among people who can be considered atheists or at least agnostic even if they do have spiritual or religious beliefs (as mentioned in atheism). In many parts of the Western world though, many atheists are irreligious and probably also significantly less likely to be superstitious. Therefore as Warofdreams said, it's a big if. Hitting on one final aspect, what are superstitions? Religions have already been addressed. But what about stuff like belief in urban legends such as fan deaths, or traditional medicine (which covers a wide variety of stuff from herbs or tiger bones or whatever, to acupuncture, to faith healing), or belief in evil government conspiracies, or that the holocaust didn't really happen, or that aliens have visited earth, or vaccine nonsense or Chinese restaurant syndrome etc? The other complicating factor is people may do stuff for cultural reasons or just out of habit without really 'believing' in the superstitions. BTW, as for that list, it doesn't have that many countries. It has virtually no Muslim countries and African countries. Place like Saudi Arabia may very well have less then 7% atheists (although accurate statistics would be almost impossible to come up with) Nil Einne (talk) 16:08, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Baseball players, ranging from the devout to the atheist, typically will not step on the foul line when running on or off the field. Is that an American thing? Or is it a cultural thing? →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots01:12, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Bentham and Hooker

These are two well-known taxonomists.They spent most of their lives in India.They classified plants,animals and pretty much everything there was to classify.They conducted surveys of industries and even classified tabularly hundreds of Indian castes and sub-castes.Hooker even wrote about the peculiarities of people of each caste.But I could not find this "Caste Survey" anywhere.Does anyone know where it could be found?--Adi4094 (talk) 03:16, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure on the specific works you are looking for, but the people in question are George Bentham and Joseph Dalton Hooker. With those specific names, you should be able to track down the works you are seeking. --Jayron32 03:27, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Are you sure they wrote on the people of each caste? In the British library catalogue I can find The flora of British India, Himalayan Journals: or, Notes of a Naturalist in Bengal, the Sikkim, and Nepal Himalayas, the Khasia Mountains, etc. and A Century of Indian Orchids by Hooker, and a lot of other botanical works by both men, but no studies of the caste system. Are you sure this isn't a mistranslation? What was your source that told you about them? --82.41.11.134 (talk) 22:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Blocking calls to my landline phone

I've suddenly started getting loads of calls from annoying 'people' asking to speak to someone who doesn't live here. They are claiming to be Barclays BankorLittlewoods but I doubt they are. One of them is just a machine. I've searched their numbers online and found loads of others having similar problems with these numbers. So how do I block these calls? I'm in the UK and I've got a BT landline being run by Orange. Thanks.91.109.234.25 (talk) 18:57, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You might like to look at Telephone Preference Service, It is free. I am subscribed to this and while it does not stop everything (we get calls with far-east accents asking for people we don't know, and then want to suddenly speak to us!!) it has reduced the annoying calls considerably. If it is an unrecorded call that sounds as though it might be from somewhere in the UK it is interesting to see what happens when you ask them for their contact number because you wish to report the infringement. Richard Avery (talk) 19:10, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In the US I occasionally get some similar calls. Recently, the College of William and Mary was calling five or six times a day - as late as 21:00 - asking for money (a family member went there). Then they hung up when we didn't answer, making for an unpleasant answering machine recording! People that we didn't know also called from such far-fetched places as Denver, Miami, and Moncton, BC! Fortunately, I discovered a feature of my phone that shuts off calls from a particular number after Caller ID data comes through, so all you hear is one ring. If your phone doesn't have such a feature, then the phone company might do it for an extra fee. Xenon54 / talk / 19:35, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
My annoyance by telemarketers stopped when I installed an answering machine. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 10:27, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
..but the bill goes up when one has to call back. 86.4.186.107 (talk) 12:48, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Don't know how it works in the UK, but in the US, you can get caller ID so you know who's calling, and answering machines where you can "pick up" in case it's a "real" call. With those two machines, in combination, you can effectively screen your calls. Just don't mention your name in the answering machine greeting - make it generic. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots22:30, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
(Click) You know who is not you know where so you know what to do when you hear the you know what. PEEP. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 20:33, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Phones have become another spam conduit, just like email. Putting your number on an opt-out list just tells spammers that the number actually reaches a person, so you get MORE spam. There is really nothing to do under the current phone system other than install some kind of client side filtering that prevents your phone from ringing unless the call presents a white-listed caller ID or else the person calling enters an access code after your machine answers. There is talk here in the US of adding another digit or two to phone numbers once the North American Numbering Plan fills up in a few years. Personally if I could have a 20-digit phone number (long enough to be immune to war dialing) I'd want one. My friends could put it in their speed dialers so the length wouldn't be a problem for them. 69.228.171.150 (talk) 19:58, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Energy Drinks vs Coffee

Iscaffeine the sole active ingredient in Energy Drinks that provide mental stimulation to increase alertness? If so, then will a bottle of energy drink containing 150 mg of caffeine provide the same stimulation as a cup of coffee providing 150 mg of caffeine? Do all the other stuff such us ginseng, taurine, vitamin B's have any role in mental stimulation? Thanks. Acceptable (talk) 19:18, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

See Ginseng. Who then was a gentleman? (talk) 20:26, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Also, do not forget that sugar is food energy. Much of the sugar in your energy drink will reach your brain at some point and provide fuel. Googlemeister (talk) 20:57, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
We have articles on each of those ingredients which describe their benefits, if any. You can look the information up as easily as we can... --Mr.98 (talk) 16:19, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

BBC radio archive

Does a recording exist of the BBC quarterly programme "The Countryside in Summer" for 1954, 1955, 1956, 1957? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.222.133 (talk) 21:04, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I would suggest you go to the BBC radio website [6] and contact them. I have found them very helpful in the past. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.4.186.107 (talk) 05:49, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Translation of the word "free"

In reading some of the comments about the possible meaning of "free" and the possibility of purposeful ambiguity, I wondered if the word "libre" in the Spanish and French versions conveyed the proper range of meaning. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Waltermclauren (talkcontribs) 22:14, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I am having difficulty understanding the question. "Versions" of what? Are you talking about the translation of an English work to Spanish or French, or a translation of a Spanish or French work to English; or are you asking whether the word "libre" would be nicely unambiguous to use in the English language in general circumstances? (And this question probably belongs on the Language reference desk, where people smarter than I, about languages at least, reside.) Comet Tuttle (talk) 22:28, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In French, "libre" means free in the sense "without constraint", and "gratuit" or "gratis" mean "without paying" (source: Concise Collins Robert dictionary). This is different to English, which has only one word for both meanings. I assume the question refers to the free speech vs free beer distinction. I don't know Spanish but I believe they have a similar division. Wikipedia has an article Gratis versus Libre. --82.41.11.134 (talk) 22:30, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Incidentally, Wikipedia:Reference desk/Language might be a better place to ask this. --82.41.11.134 (talk) 22:31, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Cúba libre? —— Shakescene (talk) 22:53, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Vive le Quebec libre!" Words of Charles DeGaulle that endeared him to the rest of Canada. We use "gratis" in English to mean no-cost. "Gratis" is from Latin, "Free" is from the German side of English. "Liberation" is freedom in English. Etc. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots23:25, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I hope you're kidding about endearing himself to the rest of Canada. As far as I know, that angered a lot of Canadians who (rightly, in my opinion) thought that he was meddling into Canada's internal politics. See Quebec seperatism#Emergence. Or actually, Vive le Québec libregENIUS101 19:19, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Gratis" as a root has to do with "pleasing". Something that's "gratis" is a "favor", rather than charging for it. Another good English word for something free of charge is "complimentary". →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots23:38, 16 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Free" in the sense of no payment in English is really short for "free of charge". There's the common English colloquialism, "Free, gratis and for nothing." —— Shakescene (talk) 00:03, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

‘I wondered if the word "libre" in the Spanish and French versions conveyed the proper range of meaning’ really calls for the services of a recent troll. Or those tiresome (and almost always mistaken) souls who always harp,『The —–— have no word for ———』[war, hatred, revenge, etc.] On the other hand, one of the purposes of NewspeakinGeorge Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-four was to limit the meaning of words like "free", so that while "equal", for example, still existed as a word, "all mans is equal" would be as obviously absurd as "all mans have red hair". Thus "Freedom is Slavery" on the walls of the Ministry of Love (miniluv). —— Shakescene (talk) 00:13, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Though, in a strict sense, "all men are equal" is false and obviously absurd unless you mean, "equal before the eyes of the law" — and even then, it's an ideal, not a reality. --Mr.98 (talk) 16:18, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
This comes up in the OpenSource software community all the time - the ambiguity of the word "free" in the context of "free software" in English has often been a source of confusion. Hence, it has come to be explained as "free (as in free beer!)" versus "free (as in free speech)"...and of course not all OpenSourced software is both of those things, so the need to disambiguate is paramount. We might say "Firefox is free (as in beer) and also free (as in speech) - but Internet Explorer is only free (as in beer)." SteveBaker (talk) 03:25, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I've always thought "free as in beer" told you a little too much about the demographic in question... --Mr.98 (talk) 16:18, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Here are lots of English dictionaries whose many definitions of "free" you can scour. For when and how these meanings have arisen see the etmology of free. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 10:19, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There are many, many senses of the word "free": something can be "free" because it is unrestrained ("free speech", "free-running water"), independent ("free state"), or liberated ("freeman"); because it is available for no cost ("free lunch"); or because it is rid of some contaminant or substance ("sugar-free"); or because it is not occupied or engaged ("a free seat", "free time"). There are a number of universities called Someplace Free University, which are "free" because they are independent and nondenominational, not necessarily because they don't charge tuition. --FOo (talk) 04:06, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
We have an article, Gratis versus Libre, that describes two meanings of "free" when applied to information. 69.228.171.150 (talk) 19:59, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

October 17

i want to know some info. about Britanniya industry, taratola,kolkata

information about Britanniya industry, taratola, kolkata,

about their.
  1. general information.
  2. environment.
  3. product and progress.
  4. marketing.
  5. finance.
  6. human resorce.Prasenjitghosh (talk) 05:40, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I suggest you look at their official website.--Shantavira|feed me 08:00, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Argument of silence (conspiracy theories)

Can anyone direct me to an article (or article section) that describes the "argument of silence" in relation to conspiracy theories... i.e. the claim that the lack of information on a subject is evidence in itself that the information sought after has been covered up?

Its likely described under a different name. The similar Argument from silence doesn't appear to be what I'm looking for (the silence in that scenario seems to be interpreted as an indication that the silent party does not have the information they previously claimed to have, not the silent party denying they have the information in the first place), and it doesn't look like there is anything in conspiracy theoryorcover-up (or if there is, I missed it).

Thanks in advance. -- saberwyn 09:51, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I assume you looked at Conspiracy_theory#Study of conspiratism that gives some useful links in the section "Psychological origins". The article UFO conspiracy theory describes the classic case of alleged suppression of information. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 10:12, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
This isn't what you asked for, but I think the "argument of silence" is a case of affirming the consequent, if that helps. (If there is a cover-up, there will be no information: there is no information, therefore there is a cover-up.) 213.122.50.254 (talk) 11:34, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I believe Argument from ignorance and Evidence of absence are what you're looking for. It comes up a lot in Religious arguments against Evolution, as well. ~ Amory (utc) 12:09, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There have been, incidentally, times when this has been true. Georgii Flerov used the fact that no American scientists were publishing on nuclear fission in 1942 to deduce that the US had indeed started a nuclear weapons program. The Manhattan Project did enforce rigorous scientific and press censorship as a means of keeping their work secret. --Mr.98 (talk) 15:05, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It has been suggested that the silence of the Kennedys helped to unwittingly fuel the conspiracy theories about the JFK assassination. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots15:33, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, right, perception of silence can fuel conspiracy theories; what I'm offering up here is an instance in which that was actually correct (that is, the "conspiracy theory" was valid, and the silence was evidence of it). --Mr.98 (talk) 16:13, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
No question. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots16:48, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Aparanoid person perceives themself as central figure in events which have no reference to them in reality as directed at or about them, though the evidence to support that perception is only silence. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 16:41, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
You've hit upon the attraction of conspiracy theories - the idea that there is "secret information" that only certain ones are "in on", thus lending artificial importance to their drab, wretched lives. (Borrowing a Tom Lehrer quote.) The Moon hoax fairy tale is one of those. So is "Area 51", the "top-secret" government testing location that everyone knows about. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots16:48, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Erm, except scarequote Area 51 scarequote is a top-secret government testing location that everyone knows about. FiggyBee (talk) 21:17, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The nature of the tests is secret. The location is not. And the absence of information about the specific tests, leads to speculation about UFO's and other such nonsense. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots22:26, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Just to elaborate on the Flerov example, the reason why the Soviet government didn't label Flerov a looney is because 1. he was actually an expert in the field he was talking about, and 2. there was good reason to suspect that the publications would be there if people were working on it openly (there were hundreds of publications relating to fission just before WWII... and then suddenly, almost nothing). These are, of course, rather specific conditions—ones that most conspiracy theories don't meet. --Mr.98 (talk) 18:34, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think you can say the silence was any sort of evidence of the existence of the nuclear weapons program. It may have been evidence of the scientist's and the government's wish to keep it secret, but in order to link those two things, you first have to know not only that there's something they're keeping a secret about, but also specifically what that secret is. In other words, you have to be an "insider". Otherwise, we could leap to all sorts of weird conclusions, such as "The government has never made any statements about a race of purple aliens living in the deep forests of Paraguay, so that proves there is a a race of purple aliens living in the deep forests of Paraguay". -- JackofOz (talk) 21:43, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, yes, but you're ignoring the history involved and I'm not sure why. It wasn't the absence of articles, it was the sharp reduction in articles that provided the evidence. That was suspicious. Matt Deres (talk) 23:05, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There's a risk in trying to interpret silence. In the case of The Bomb, someone guessed right. But think of something mundane, such as a police investigation. Sometimes silence means they are closing in on a suspect and don't want to give away the game; other times it means they haven't a clue, and they've turned their attention to other cases. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots23:11, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
And it's true that one can guess wrong historically as well. The President of the University of California knew that the physicists were working on a secret project, but didn't know what. He guessed it was a death ray. That was incorrect (but close enough to rankle Manhattan Project security when he made it public). --Mr.98 (talk) 23:27, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you all for some enlightening reading. -- saberwyn 10:21, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The phrase I am familiar with is conspiracy of silence - try searching for that. 78.151.108.233 (talk) 15:22, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Social Security in the Untied States, and different costs of living

If I'm reading right, Social Security payments in the U.S. are the same from state to state; at least, from what I've read, it doesn't sound like an averge. Why is this, considering that the cost of living in, say, New York City is so much different than the cost of living in rural Iowa, for instance? I understand that it would be hard to recalculate every time a person moved, and really would have been before computers, so it makes sense that it didn't factor in every locality in the U.S. at first. Still, the checks have to go somewhere, at least into a bank account? With computers now, wouldn't it be pretty easy to at least calculate every year?

Or, am I misunderstanding, and there really are differences between localities? I saw nothing in the Social Security debate (all about privization versus not, and other issues), or in our articles as I skimmed, t least.4.68.248.130 (talk) 14:20, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know if it is the same everywhere or not, but if it is the reason could be one of fairness. While wages (and therefore tax payments) are higher in places with a higher cost of living, there is nothing stopping someone working all their life in a low wage area and then moving to a high state pension area and getting more that the share they paid for (or vice versa). --Tango (talk) 15:03, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Good piont, I hadn't thought of that.4.68.248.130 (talk) 17:27, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Though... one could also move into a place where money went further and get the same benefit, theoretically. You could imagine a rather fair system—e.g., something like the per diem system, where different cities have different costs of living associated with them, and your social security rates would be some percentage of a maximum rate for that given area. But that would be complicated. --Mr.98 (talk) 18:37, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Then there are the people who aren't even living in the US and are collecting SS checks. I worked with a retired guy here in China that was getting ~$500 a month in SS. $500 a month in rural China is a king's ransom. It covered all his (quite comfortable) living expenses and what he made teaching English was all just play money. 218.25.32.210 (talk) 07:20, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Foreign taxi drivers in the US

How do foreigners become a taxi driver in the US? I suppose they don't get a green card as highly skilled workers, do they?--Quest09 (talk) 18:04, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You don't need a green card to work. If search and read Permanent residence (United States) you'll find that is says right in the beginning that while the application is pending aliens can receive a work card, namely the Employment Authorization Document. There are also other visas (such as for students) that allow aliens to work. Also, just because someone looks different and has different customs than you doesn't make them foreign. ~ Amory (utc) 21:53, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Foreigners" in the sense of "foreign born", i.e. "immigrants", although you can't always judge that, either. To work legally you need to be here legally, of course. And we get lots of legal immigrants every year. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots02:15, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Working in the USA

Inspired by the question above, I'm curious about this too. I'm what Quest09 might call a "highly skilled worker", yet most/all employers who I consider applying for a job with, have a note that applicants must be eligible to work in the USA. I understand that to mean a non-resident foreigner such as myself, would already need to have a H-1B visa to even be considered for employment. And yet that visa must be applied for by the employer some months in advance and a substantial fee paid (again by the employer).

It seems to me that I need to already have a H-1B visa to be considered for employment, yet the visa application cannot be made without having a job to go in the first place. How does a foreigner get a job in the USA (whether a taxi driver or something else)? Astronaut (talk) 23:23, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some employers will only consider persons who are already eligible to work in the United States: citizens and resident foreigners with visas permitting work other than the H-1B. The most common such visa is the IR type. Other employers are willing to sponsor a foreigner for an H-1B visa, but these are typically employers who are unable to find qualified applicants who are already eligible to work in the United Statesfor unfilled positions . In this economy, there are fewer such positions available than in the past. It is not enough to be highly skilled. One must have a skill that employers cannot find in adequate supply among existing US residents. Marco polo (talk) 02:14, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Apparantly you can work or settle in the USA without any restrictions if you have a master's degree. 78.151.108.233 (talk) 15:25, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That's not true. I think you are talking about an EB2 visa - that's for "Professionals holding advanced degrees (Ph.D., master's degree, or at least 5 years of progressive post-baccalaureate experience) or persons of exceptional ability in sciences, arts, or business" - but there is a quota of 40,000 of those per year - they aren't granted automatically - and you have to jump through a lot of hoops to get one. However, that's not a permanent status - it takes many years and many lawyers to turn that into a green card. SteveBaker (talk) 16:29, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Aren't their restrictions on criminal records (particularly offences committed in the USA)? --Tango (talk) 16:12, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not that interested in gaining US citizenship or becoming a permanent resident and I'm not closely related to a US citizen, but nor am I a criminal. Unfortunately, with my skill-set, around half the world's temporary contract positions are based in the USA, yet it seems impossible to apply for them unless I am already permitted to work in the USA. Unsurprisingly, most potential employers are unwilling to jump through the USCIS's hoops, pay the fee and wait some time, just to hire someone on a 6 or 12 months contract.
All of which brings us to the taxi drivers mentioned by Quest09 in the question above. If it is made so difficult for me to secure temporary work in the USA, how is it apparently so easy for a foreigner to get a visa and work as a taxi driver? - of course, I'm assuming there is some truth in the TV/movie stereotype of the foreigner arriving in New York City and immediately getting work as a taxi driver. Astronaut (talk) 02:16, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
With cab drivers, the immigrants often arrive in North America with very different skills, but end up working as cab drivers because it's one of the few jobs available. Why ? because the pay is poor and the level of skills required quite low, which means turnout is high and there are always openings for those willing to work the night hours of a car owned by another driver. As a result, immigrants who have made it to North America, either with a degree that that does not translate into employment here, or without a degree through the Green Card lottery, refugee resettlement, or other non-skill based immigration programs, end up working in the sector in large numbers.
It happens in all sorts of other low-paying, low-skill areas of the economy - cleaning staff, slaughterhouse workers, restaurant employees - but cab drivers tend to have than other such jobs, so they get noticed more. In Canada, it is a cliché that an immigrant with an engineering degree from the developing world will end up driving a taxicab. Also, one should not compare cab drivers in North America, which is a low-skilled profession, with those in London or other European cities in which obtaining a license requires passing a demanding exam. --Xuxl (talk) 18:25, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed: "The knowledge" (as the London 'black cab' Taxi-driver exam is called) is a gruelling test. You literally have to memorize the entire map of London - including one-way systems, speed limits, where the traffic snarls are - and to be able to describe the most efficient route from any street to any other completely from memory. Most applicants take close to three years(!) to learn what they need. The average person takes 12 attempts to get through the exam! That's tougher than most college degrees. One presumes that on arrival in the US, there are few jobs one can just walk into. Even if you have good qualifications, it can take months to find a job. What do you do in the meantime? Drive a cab. I suspect that for a lot of these people, this is a second job - one they can do for a few hours in the evenings after their day-job. SteveBaker (talk) 02:54, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Who came up with 4 rings when you call someone to be acceptable

Why is it 4 rings on a phone before you disconnect? why not 3 or 5? Who came up with this number that everyone seems to follow? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ivtv (talkcontribs) 23:32, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In what circumstances is this a "rule"? I often call and will wait for a dozen rings or more before deciding that the person I'm calling is not there. Astronaut (talk) 23:37, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I've never heard of it. If you follow it, don't - rings are meaningless. The rings you hear in no way correspond to the rings the person on the other end hears. If it takes a long time to connect, you can easily hear five or six rings before the target phone rings once. And that's not to mention the fact that ringtones usually play once - does that count as one ring? ~ Amory (utc) 23:43, 17 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I never hang up after as few as 4 rings (unless I suddenly change my mind about wanting to talk to that person at all). I give them a minimum of 10, usually more like 20. It's incredibly irritating when you're away from the phone when it rings, and you rush to answer it, only for them to have just hung up. So I don't do that to my phonointerlocutors. -- JackofOz (talk) 01:15, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I agree entirely. I get very annoyed with anyone hanging up after fewer than seven or eight rings - there are circumstances in which it's simply not possible to get to a phone in that time (mobiles included). I find only four rings an astonishingly small number to use as a "rule". FWIW, I usually wait 50 seconds (17 rings - a ring lasts one second and gaps between rings are two seconds*) before hanging up. Grutness...wha? 01:39, 18 October 2009 (UTC) (* yes, I was bored one day and timed it.)[reply]

Besed on at least canada it is 4 rings and the way the phone system works is when I hear a ring its silent on their end. On my silence it rings on their end. After 4 rings and a silence we hang up. Thought it was a world thing haha. if someone called my land line and let it ring 10-20 times i would answer and lose my mind for being rude. Ivtv (talk) 01:43, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Typically it's four rings before the answering machine kicks in. It's always been that way as far as I know. ('Always' being a relative term, as answering machines started to become widely popular sometime in the 1970s or so.) You can set it to fewer rings, typically. It's probably that someone estimated the average amount of time it would take the average person to get up and walk across the room. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots02:11, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
And if no answering machine kicks in, normally you would stick around for awhile, minimum 8 rings, perhaps. →Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots02:13, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Baseball Bugs, about answering machines' four rings standard: Answering machine designers likely had to choose a number of rings high enough to let the receiving party answer the phone if they're home, but also low enough to prevent callers from hanging up before leaving a message. (If no one left a message, an answering machine wouldn't be useful.) Four rings was likely the compromise that's become standard. --Bavi H (talk) 04:11, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Ivtv: The practice of hanging up if there's no answer after four rings was likely originally related to avoiding answering machines. Perhaps this behavior might just be a learned habit by newer generations of phone users in your area. Or maybe the people in your area are less patient to wait for an answer.
Here's the only situation in which I would hang up in such a short time. In the US, pay phones refund your money if there's no answer. If I was stranded and needed a ride, but only had enough change to make one pay-phone call, I would hang up before the end of the fourth ring to avoid getting an answering machine. I could then call someone else for help, or try calling the same number again to see if a person answered. --Bavi H (talk) 04:11, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

First, it should be noted that the speed of ringing varies from one country to another. In the US and Canada it's one ring every 6 seconds. Ann Landers used to say in her column that 10 rings was appropriate, giving the person one minute get to the phone. I still go by that (and my home phone goes to voicemail on the 8th ring), but some people today seem to think that it's much too long. They probably assume everyone either has a cellphone or a phone in every room of their house. But that's not actually true, and besides, the person might need at least a few seconds to finish their Reference Desk reply before picking up the phone. --Anonymous, 07:11 UTC, October 18, 2009.

I've never heard of a "rule" existing and I always go by a mutu (a Finnish expression meaning "what I feel like") basis. I typically hang up after a few rings, or just after the answering machine kicks in, if I'm phoning a relative or friend I know who I can phone again. If it's an important business call I leave a message. JIP | Talk 18:09, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This seems to be a cultural variable, and also differs according to the time between rings, evidently twice as long in North America. In the UK, I usually count 17 rings (50 secs) about 8 rings in USA? exactly like Grutness (above), except for people who always leave an answer phone connected, then I give six rings, wait ten seconds, then ring again if I really need a discussion rather than just leaving a message. I find it really annoying when people are too impatient to wait a reasonable time for me to answer. We don't all sit by the phone just waiting for it to ring. When I can afford it (and when technology catches up), I want a phone connected to a computer that will tell me who is ringing, and respond to a voice command to switch on the speakerphone. This has been possible for about twenty-five years, but I've never seen it marketed, so I'll just have to write a program myself. Dbfirs 19:33, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

When I call someone (in the UK), I will usually leave it about a dozen rings, or longer if I particularly need to get in touch with them. That seems to be about how long it takes the voicemail to kick in on mobiles too. On our home BT phone, the answering machine picks up after 6 rings, or after 2 if there are already messages on the machine so that you don't have to wait yonks if you're dialling in to get your messages. (The latter I find exceptionally annoying) An Internet search suggests that between anywhere between 2 and 9 rings is a common interval before an answering machine picks up with the preset usually 4 or 6. --Kateshortforbob talk 20:52, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

(Click) You know who is not you know where so you know what to do when you hear the you know what. PEEP. Cuddlyable3 (talk) 20:59, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'll join with others above in saying that the "four rings" rule has to do with answering machines. My own machine has an optional setting, answer after two rings if I have messages, four if I don't. This saves me a long-distance charge if I'm checking for messages from far away. (Note Kateshort, I can configure that, so maybe you can quell your own annoying feature)
I also think that short waiting times for phones to be answered are a product of our times. In many cases, my call really isn't so important that it needs to be answered at once, so I'd rather avoid the answering machine, which most people have nowadays in some form. And many phones nowadays have caller-ID and call-history, so my hanging up after four rings is a form of courtesy, "I'd like to talk to you but not if you're eating lunch". In the old days it was far different of course, people ran from wherever they were to answer the phone and the courteous thing was to give them enough time to finish their bath and put a robe on - but that was when phone calls were unique and important. Nowadays I don't ever answer my home phone, it's far too likely to be someone offering to clean my carpets or tell me how I've won a "free" trip to Florida. Franamax (talk) 21:36, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

October 18

hand grenades

Will an exploding fragmentation grenade start a fire in dry grass?65.78.183.48 (talk) 01:13, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Every grenade range I've been on has been free of vegetation (wonder why?), but It is very common in dry conditions for fires to erupt in the impact area of ranges using everything from small arms to mortar and arty. On a range, it will usually burn itself out due to the sparsity of vegetation. By the way, don't play with frag's. If you have found one, call the base range control/EOD or your local police. 173.124.206.41 (talk) 02:32, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I always thought that your standard military hand grenade was just a pressure system with chemicals that caused a shrapnel explosion without fire. It is not the explosion that kills it is the balls that fire off in all directions. Use matches to start a fire not a hand grenade.
Ivtv (talk) 02:45, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Um, what? A hand grenade is a metal (steel?) case around a lump of explosive, with a fuse (that burns) down the middle. There's a mechanical device to ignite the fuse at the top end (at one time percussive; not sure if they still are) and at the bottom end a I presume a detonator would be needed to initiate the main charge (I'm guessing it's high rather than low-order explosive). As you can see from my various caveats and assumptions, I'm not an expert in the field, but I can tell you that there is no "pressure system", "chemicals" (apart from the explosives), or "balls that fire off". The means of doing damage is the fragments (hence the name) of the steel case as it is blown apart by the explosion. 93.97.184.230 (talk) 10:44, 18 October 2009 (UTC) [reply]
We have an article on hand grenades, of course, that describe how they work. Some fragmentation grenades do have ball bearings or fletchettes in them to provide shrapnel damage; others get all of their shrapnel from the casing. It's true though that the system that disperses them is indeed explosive. It's true though that the explosion need not be very large or killing in and of itself—it depends on the kind of grenade it is. (Hence "sting grenades", where the ball bearings are replaced by plastic balls, and are meant to be less-lethal.) --Mr.98 (talk) 13:11, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
(EC) The section on fragmentation grenades explains what's inside them. --KageTora - SPQW - (影虎) (talk) 13:14, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
When you look at grenade explosions (eg on YouTube) you see stuff like this: [7] - which is a real grenade explosion - and has no sign of flame, just a big cloud of dust and smoke. It's not at all like a video-game or movie grenade eg: [8]. I wouldn't say it was impossible to set grass on fire that way - but it's not likely. SteveBaker (talk) 16:17, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see why you mean it's not likely to start a fire. Just think that the explosion is throwing stones against each other. That could result in the spark needed to start a fire on dry grass.--Quest09 (talk) 16:59, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't say it was impossible - I said it was unlikely. Despite what you suggest, I stand by that statement. SteveBaker (talk) 02:40, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Tactically it's easy to imagine why you wouldn't want grenades to set fire, like if they are thrown into a building, you wouldn't necessarily want to start a fire, if you did want to start a fire then you'd use an incendiary grenade. Vespine (talk) 21:40, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed. Control over the effects of weaponry is a vital aspect of the design of things like grenades. SteveBaker (talk) 02:40, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Tanks Going Through Walls

In the 1977 film Cross of Iron, there is one scene where a Russian T-34 is about to burst through the wall of a factory, and before doing so, it fires a round at the wall so there is a hole at the exact point where the main gun would go through, thus, presumably, saving it from extensive damage when the rest of the tank follows. Is this normally what would have happened? In order to burst through a wall, would the crew have to take a precaution such as this so as not to damage the gun? If so, what would be the usual round for this type of work? A HE round (possibly creating a larger hole) or an AP round (creating a hole big enough for the gun)? What would happen to hull-mounted or coaxial weapons? I presume a turret mounted outside machine gun would be damaged by falling bricks. --KageTora - SPQW - (影虎) (talk) 13:25, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It would be more typical to rotate the turret to face backwards prior to gently nudging the wall into collapse - then driving over the resulting rubble - but it's pretty rare to want to drive a tank through a building - there are all sorts of external antennae, tools and other stuff that you wouldn't want to wreck. It's dramatic for a movie - but has little tactical value. SteveBaker (talk) 16:02, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Not to mention strapped on rucksacks and duffel. A brick hung up in in the track has a high chance of "blowing track", causing it to roll off the sprockets. If the building has a basement, a tank would probably break through. You don't want debris hung up in the main gun. ---— Gadget850 (Ed) talk 16:19, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Add the fact that any upper wall or roof would probably collapse on top of the tank and you've got a suicide mission.--Shantavira|feed me 17:21, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In the movie "Tank" (1984) James Garner removed the machine gun from the turret of his pet Sherman tank and reversed the turret so the gun trailed before ramming the tank through the wall of a jail to free his son. Building materials falling on a gunbarrel could bend it or break the elevating mechanism, rendering it useless. Treads are easily broken or jammed. Edison (talk) 00:51, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
This reminded me of the opening sceneofRichard IIIbyIan McKellen where a tank penetrates a wall but suffers no problems. --Blue387 (talk) 08:31, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
So, given the amount of evidence and common sense to the contrary, it is shocking to have to acknowledge that this type of scene appears quite often in war films. Thanks, everyone. --KageTora - SPQW - (影虎) (talk) 12:25, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I don't know why you're shocked. Movie makers do this kind of thing all the time. When is the last time you saw a car drive off a cliff-side road in a movie, rolling over and over and then exploding? Why would it explode? How many people have you seen who avoid being shot by ducking down below the level of the windows in a car? Almost any bullet will go through a twentieth of an inch of steel, a thin sheet of plastic and some padding and kill the person on the other side. How many cars have you seen exploding after someone put a bullet through the gas tank? The Mythbusters fired hundreds of rounds from dozens of weapons at the gas tanks of cars without getting so much as a flame. A spaceship out in the vacuum of space making a noise? How is the sound being transmitted?! Lasers travelling so slowly that people can dodge them? What exactly is the speed of light? I could go on and on. There are vast numbers of things they show time after time in movies that are quite utterly bogus. So tank-driving-through-a-wall - it's just another one of those spectacular things that movie makers love. At least in this case, it's plausible that a sizeable tank at full speed could demolish a house - it's just not plausible that a tank driver would generally choose to do that. SteveBaker (talk) 02:36, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
With the lasers, it all depends on what they are travelling through - you need some slow light. Warofdreams talk 14:02, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Vegetarianism and absolutism

My sister is a vegetarian and a woman I know is an absolutist. But how common is it to be both at the same time? Is this more common among men or women? JIP | Talk 18:01, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

From the Wikipedia article absolutism, it doesn't appear that my intended meaning of "absolutist" is clear. It means one who abstains from alcohol. JIP | Talk 18:03, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well we don't called such a person an "absolutist" but rather a teetotaler -- 41.136.72.103 (talk) 19:06, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutist seems to be a Swedish term for a person dedicated to sobriety. Maybe a subtle advertisement for this Swedish based producer of vegetarian refreshments? --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 19:38, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I would presume quite a few people with strong religions regions for being vegetarian, e.g. Buddhist vegetarianismorChristian vegetarianism among monks/brothers/nuns would also likely refrain from drinking alcohol if their religious beliefs prohibit or discourage it, e.g. Buddhism#Buddhist ethics [9] [10]. This obviously doesn't directly answer how common it is. Nil Einne (talk) 20:03, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Personally, I absolutely refuse to drink non-vegetarian alcohol.DOR (HK) (talk) 06:41, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, I was thinking yesterday that, at the very least, you can rule out any meat-based wines. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots12:24, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, you can forget traditional scrumpy then. Mikenorton (talk) 16:04, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
First of all, yuck.
Second, one of the things I've learned from WP is that some vegetarians have scruples about drinking beer that has been clarified with isinglass, a product made from fish scales swimbladders. I wonder what fraction of vegetarians, or even vegans, really manage to avoid all byproducts of the meat industry. It would be fairly difficult. --Trovatore (talk) 23:06, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
For example, the question of what those vegetables were fertilized with. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots13:04, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
World-wide, I don't think most teetotalers are vegetarian, since the major religions that prohibit alcohol (Islam and some Protestant sects) don't particularly encourage vegetarianism. And I don't think most vegetarians are teetotalers, since the main religions that promote vegetarianism (Jainism and Hinduism) don't have admonitions against alcohol. If there is a positive correlation between vegetarianism and teetotalism, I don't believe it's a strong one.
Two cultural groups I can think of in which it would be very common to find people who are both a teetotaler and a vegetarian are the straight edge culture, and the Seventh Day Adventists. Red Act (talk) 08:29, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Hinduism may not formally ban alcohol, but as I understand it there is little tradition of alcoholic drink in India. I'm not exactly sure why. But if I'm correct about that, there may be an enormous number of combined vegetarians and non-alcohol-drinkers (perhaps not "teetotalers" formally, just that the issue never comes up). --Trovatore (talk) 22:49, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like you're right. Doing a little further research, I see that Alcoholic beverage#Alcohol and religion says that some sects of Hinduism are anti-alcohol. And the Gujarat article says that the sale of alcohol is banned there. The Indian state of Gujarat has 50 million people, of which 89% are Hindu. Red Act (talk) 04:02, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Ernesto "Che Guevara" - a legend - a myth - or a fact?

OK - I have just been moved to tears by the movie, "Motorcycle Diaries" in which the pre-medical graduate Ernesto Guevara and his friend travelled around South America in 1952. I have also studied many references to Guevara, including Wikipedia. I have read books about his completion of his medical studies and his degree. But yet again, I have now learned this was a hoax. He may have begun a medical degree course at The University in Argentina, but there is no record of him having graduated from there as a medical doctor. So once again, at the age of 62, it seems I have been led up the garden path by emotional blackmail. Please help me here. Did he actually graduate as a doctor? And please.....no responses about whether that matters given his other "spurious and heroic achievements". Thanks. 92.23.23.50 (talk) 22:38, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Our article on Che Guevara notes he attended medical school from 1948-1952 (with a year off for the noted Motorcycle Journey), but in 1953 could not find placement in an internship. See the section titled "Guatemala, Arbenz and United Fruit". Later, apparently, he worked as an allergist in a Mexico city hospital (See section titled "Mexico City and preparation") so he was at least for a time in 1954, a working physician. By 1955, he started out as a combat medic for the Cuban revolutionary forces, but quickly abandoned that track for military training, and he soon abandoned his medical career and took up a military leadership role. --Jayron32 00:20, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Jayron - but doesn't that result conflict with the following extract taken from the Che Guevara Wiki article viz. Upon returning to Argentina, he completed his studies and received his medical degree in June 1953, making him officially "Dr. Ernesto GuevaraItalic text?92.22.19.48 (talk) 12:46, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I presume -1952 was a typo as our article says he graduated in 1953. Otherwise Jayron's summation appears to be accurate Nil Einne (talk) 16:15, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Does Argentina follow the practice of English-speaking countries of referring to medical graduates as "doctor"? In any case, it's not "official", merely a custom. -- JackofOz (talk) 19:53, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Shinnecock Indian Nation

I am trying to find out the status of my family with the Shinnecock Indian Nation could you please refer me to the correct person i can correspond with I have some documentation on my family background and being part of that tribe from Long Island,New York. I would like to go over these documents and be able to register with the International Bureau of Affairs. But i dont know how to go about doing that and theres other questions I have .Thank you for your time.66.243.202.141 (talk) 22:56, 18 October 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.23.23.50 (talk) [reply]

Try the tribe's website for starters. It even lists some cell phone numbers of individuals you can call. By the way, our Shinnecock Indian Nation article (which needs expansion) says the tribe is recognized by the state of New York, but the tribe's website implies that it isn't recognized by the federal government, so the Bureau of Indian Affairs may not care about your "registering" with them. Tempshill (talk) 02:49, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Snoop dogg

I have noticed that in most of his songs Snoop Dogg really just talks. I wonder if he actually has a good singing voice. Does anyone know of a song or recording that I can look up where he is actually singing?--98.240.70.102 (talk) 23:37, 18 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

On several of his songs he sings, for example on the Dr. Dre song Nuthin' but a "G" Thang, Snoop definately imparts a melody when he sings the chorus "Ain't nothing but a G thang baby/two loked out g's going crazy/Death row is the label that pays me." --Jayron32 00:14, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
(This should be on the Entertainment Desk.) He "sings" a bit on The Chronic... Nuthin' but a G Thang; Deeez Nuuuts; Bitches Ain't Shit. It's nothing special. He's better as a straight rapper. --Mr.98 (talk) 01:44, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

October 19

What if WWII Did Not Occur?

I read somewhere, that when Hitler's Mom was pregnant with him, she wanted to get an abortion, but the doctor convinced her otherwise. While this may have prevented WWII from occurring hence, preventing the horrible events of the Holocaust, is there anything positive that WWII brought to the world or positively influenced some part of the world today? Acceptable (talk) 01:50, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You may enjoy parts of our Alternate history article (search for "hitler" on the page; the "assassinate Hitler in the crib" plot is a popular 'bull session' topic). Sure, nuclear power is arguably a positive that came out of (or at least was greatly accelerated because of the events of) WW2. The jet engine and rocketry were invented and greatly accelerated, respectively. (I'm going to ignore the pre-WW2 claims in the jet engine article.) Tempshill (talk) 02:10, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
A few more: The United Nations was probably a positive. Computers were first invented (I'm brushing aside other claims) as codebreakers; see Cryptanalysis of the Enigma. A lot of Decolonization occurred after WW2. Some people think the Constitution of Japan forced upon Japan by the US is an improvement over their earlier legal system. Tempshill (talk) 02:42, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Hitler’s role in WWII was hugely Euro-centric. The war in Asia almost certainly would have occurred even if Hitler had never been born. Indeed, Japan invaded China in September 1931, some two years prior to Hitler becoming chancellor of Germany. Hence, to suggest certain inventions or arrangements depended on Hitler is a bit of a stretch. DOR (HK) (talk) 06:51, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Attributing the occurrence of the War in Europe solely or mainly to Hitler requires a tacit acceptance of the Great man theory. (Note that in this context "great" refers only to degree of influence, and does not necessarily signify any form of approval.) As you will see from reading through that article, this theory is now largely out of fashion: currently historians argue instead that such major events are brought about by impersonal factors of economics, demographics, etc, and that individuals effect only the details, so absent Hitler, WW2 in Europe might have started a little earlier or later and proceeded differently at minor levels, but would still have happened. 87.81.230.195 (talk) 11:21, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
If the conquering nations of WWI had treated Germany as nicely as we did following WWII, the "need" for a Hitler and a WWII might never have arisen, at least not in Europe. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots12:23, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
For a humorous take on the idea that does a fair job of fleshing out the difficulties, see Hitler's Time Travel Exemption Act. --Mr.98 (talk) 12:42, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Great quote from that page "It might be much easier and more efficient just to ... kill Bismarck ... or kill Metternich ... or kill Napoleon ... but everyone is just so short-sighted they want to kill Hitler. Stop it: all it's doing is making him feel smug!" -- 128.104.112.179 (talk) 14:10, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That article is not really about the effects of getting rid of Hitler, it's about the science-fiction stories on that subject, stories which are in no way sensibly researched or argued. They don't constitute evidence that killing Hitler wouldn't help any more than they constitute evidence that computers will print "error, error" and explode when asked to calculate pi. The motivation for most of these stories isn't to explore the premise, it's simple sour grapes: we can't change the past, so let's try to feel better about ourselves by arguing that our sucky world is the best of all possible ones. The arguments still work when the time travel element is taken out. Millions of children suffer from malnutrition; should we try to help them? Well, the world is dangerously overpopulated as it is; maybe they had better die and decrease the surplus population. Besides, if we save them one of them might grow up to be the next Hitler. An asteroid is going to hit the earth; we could try to deflect it, but is that really a good idea? -- BenRG (talk) 15:28, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I think you give the science fiction less than enough credit on thinking things through. They do about as reasonable a job as the counter-factual historians can. The moral isn't "our world is great", the moral is, "our world is unavoidably constituted out of the consequences of the past." --Mr.98 (talk) 21:19, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Or to put it another way, suppose I could go back and kill Hitler. This would presumably result in my never being born (and the same for anyone born after, at a conservative estimate, 1945 — actually I would expect the cutoff to be much earlier). Is that a sacrifice I'd be willing to make? And then who exactly would go back and kill Hitler? This is only a slight elaboration on the grandfather paradox. --Trovatore (talk) 22:02, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"What if WWII did not occur?" seems to express uncertainty about whether it did. "What if WWI had not occurred?" would express uncertainty about what would have happened rather than about what did happen. Michael Hardy (talk) 14:14, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

...do we really need to be this pedantic about grammar? Is this really a useful contribution? --Mr.98 (talk) 21:19, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
No and no. --Tango (talk) 21:30, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"Hitler didn't create the WWII era; the WWII era created Hitler." Duomillia (talk) 17:44, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

That makes no sense. Do the quotation marks mean that you have a WP:RS for that nonsense or just that you are trying to dissociate yourself from it while posting it? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 21:24, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The era may not have created Hitler, but it made it possible for him to come to power. I second your question about the quotes, though (although it doesn't really matter who said it). --Tango (talk) 21:30, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It may be just hollow rhetoric, but I guess it's true in the sense that without World War II (and the continental Holocaust it enabled), Hitler, while still having existed, would be merely one of dozens of brilliant but half-mad dictators and tyrants blessedly forgotten by history, and one of the less attractive ones at that. Semioticians and semanticists would make tiresome distinctions between Hitler and "Hitler". —— Shakescene (talk) 21:34, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
(ec) Hitler, and the Nazi government, was a product of the peculiar political and economic circumstances surrounding Germany and Europe generally in that period. An ineffective League of Nations, the unsustainable legacy of Versailles, an unbridled world economy which had barely survived the depression - all of these provided the breedingground for extremist politics. The National Socialists were around before Hitler came along; Fascism developed with little input from Hitler; even if all the extremist right-wing groups somehow died out without Hitler, Communism was immensely popular in many of the same states. Even if Hitler never existed, the same pressures would, probably, have pushed Europe towards war, with some other strong-jawed leader at the helm. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 21:37, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I think we can give Hitler credit (or blame) for his version of National Socialism, even though there were other similar names and ideas floating around, such as National Bolshevism, National Syndicalism and the Social Nationalism of the anti-Semitic Mayor of Vienna (Karl Schoenerer?). And certainly, Fascism's origins owe far more to Mussolini, to whom Hitler always gave credit. So there would have been fascism and even some form of national socialism without Hitler. But before Hitler (party member number 7), the future National Socialist German Workers' Party was simply the German Workers' PartyofAnton Drexler.—— Shakescene (talk) 21:56, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
But Mussolini's fascism, though it embodied an obnoxious, liberticidal cult of the State, was hardly on the road to gas chambers, at least from anything I've ever heard about it. The transition from the Hoodlum State to the Assassin State required Hitler, personally. I don't buy the determinism-of-social-trends argument. The social pressures are there, but how they crystallize around a charismatic leader depends very much on that leader. --Trovatore (talk) 22:35, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Hitler couldn't have done it without lots of supporters. One of those supporters could easily have taken his place if he weren't there. While he was unusually good orator, I expect there were like-minded people that were good enough. --Tango (talk) 22:47, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Could have" is not the same as "would have". The great man theory may have been overdone, but the cultural determinists are also wrong. --Trovatore (talk) 22:55, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
There is also a lot of evidence that what Stalin had in mind for Europe was just about as bad as what Hitler did and that Hitler's invasion of the USSR, as unsuccesfull as it "seemed" to be, actually derailed Stalin's plans considerably. Vespine (talk) 22:31, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I'm British and I despise and condemn the treatment of the Jewish race at the hands of the Nazi state. Having said that; I would like to play Devil's advocate. Why don't we talk, with similar hatered, about the mass bombing of German cities by the British, the fire bombing of Japanese citites by the Americans, and the two nuclear attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki by the Americans? (The development of the bomb being helped in no small measure by non-American allied scientists.) If we're from alliedoraxis nations then we should all feel thoroughly ashamed of the actions of our respective nations. ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 22:59, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Getting this thread back on track, the question of "What if there was no Hitler?" is probably one of the most-discussed bits of alternate history there is. One famous piece on the subject is "No Hitler, No Holocaust," an article by Martin Himmelfarb in the March 1984 issue of Commentary magazine, the title of which sums up the argument. Whether WWII itself would have happened without Hitler is a separate question. To say that WWI inevitably led to WWII is to absolve the actors in the drama from responsibility. However, it is no doubt likely that the widespread belief in Germany of the unfairness of the Treaty of Versailles, the lack of desire to enforce the treaty among the Allies, all of the gripes among various nations caused by the changes to the maps after WWI and the fear of Russian Communism created a milleau in which peace was unlikely to last long in any event. -- Mwalcoff (talk) 23:08, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
". . . absolve the actors in the drama from responsibility." In most dramas, the responsibility lies with the playwright (historical contingency?), and the actors have little freedom of action, so this might not be the most appropriate metaphor. Perhaps something more along the lines of a jazz improvisation? 87.81.230.195 (talk) 00:06, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

From a logical point of view, it is totally impossible to predict what might have happened had Hitler not been born. Mathematics, and especially Chaos theory, tells us that small changes to initial conditions can lead to unimagined and unpredictable changes to a dynamical system in the long run. Removing such a high-profile figure as Hitler would lead to a massive change in initial conditions and ultimately unimagined and unpredictable changes to a dynamical system that is, in an informal sense, world order and world politics. ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 23:19, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

We don't truly know if history/politics really is a dynamical system subject to Chaos theory, because we can never re-run events with variations to see if they actually do lead to macroscopic differences, or if "historical inertia" would, as some argue, return them to the trough of a "stable valley." If the unwinding of history was so amenable to calculation, we could anticipate the future consequences of present decisions much more readily and in theory avoid many unfortunate or disastrous outcomes (where are you, Hari Seldon?), although in practice even those future conditions that are somewhat amenable to mathematical calculation, such as changes in climate, are apt to provoke prevaricatory denial and obfustications serving short term interests. 87.81.230.195 (talk) 00:06, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think the analogies to math or chaos theory, while true, are accurate or appropriate; the unpredictability of human behavior trumps any card played. Call me cliché, but there's not a single damn thing in human history that could've been accurately predicted. That's why there's no point playing Monday-morning quarterback and (one of the reasons) why the Reference Desk doesn't speculate. Let's not forget that a fair portion of the world didn't know for the better part of a decade (depending on whether you were German, Polish, or American) what would have happened if Hitler was alive, and they actually had evidence to back up any decisions! ~ Amory (utc) 02:29, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
What all of this is getting at is a larger historiographical debate about whether history is focused on the acts of individuals or whether it is about structuralist transformations. The reality is a bit of both. There are actually people who make their living predicting the apparently unpredictable (see this recent NY Times article), knowing a small number of initial conditions. These can only be applied forward, not backwards, of course. On the other hand, there are no doubt lots of wildcards out there as well, especially if we are talking about past historical events. The "reality" of it is no doubt something of a mix... Hitler, the man, could not have been what he was without the conditions for his existence; on the other hand, once he reached a certain level of prominence (e.g. post-Putsch), he was himself a powerful enough actor to affect future conditions as well, and extricating him from them is pretty much impossible. There is some discussion of these different views of history in Carr's famous What is History?. --Mr.98 (talk) 12:18, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Free contract bridge software for Windows Mobile

Greetings,

Might anyone be able to tell me if there exists free contract bridge software for Windows Mobile?

Thank you in advance,

148.60.182.135 (talk) 15:09, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sock puppetry

What's the Wikipedia policy about logging out of one's account to edit under one's IP address? I've seen the special cases in the sock puppetry article, but they seem to talk about having multiple accounts. I guess it's a no-no, but can anyone direct me to the relevant policy pages, please? ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 15:41, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

WP:Help DeskorWP:VPP is better for this sort of question. In general though, having two accounts or logging out to edit is mostly treated the same. If used inappropriately a definite no-no. However there are definitely cases when it's okay. Nil Einne (talk) 15:56, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Word of waning; no matter what the policies say, checkusers often simply ban everyone on a range without checking and thus cause a hell of a lot of collateral damage. And once banned by checkuser you can kiss goodbye to ever getting your account back because NO ONE will believe you are innocent once they see checkusers supposed "confirmed" tags on it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.44.55.2 (talk) 23:09, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

To provide a (slightly less vitriolic) answer, as long as you play nice you'll be fine. Trouble starts brewing when you do things on the IP that you wouldn't normally do on your account. Since you obviously won't do that, there is rarely a reason to have to log out. People (usually sysops, as they have something to protect) do create alternate accounts for use on public terminals only. ~ Amory (utc) 02:14, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Seconding that. A checkuser recently explained to me that, realistically, there's no way to "ban everyone on a range". In practice, suspicious activity gets investigated and, if confirmed by range matches, may result in blocks. In other words, suspicious activity is a necessary condition. (But with that said, it is the case that editing from an IP, and also from a logged-in account which is based at that IP, often ends up looking suspicious. So I wouldn't do it without a good reason.) —Steve Summit (talk) 02:59, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Checkusers DO have the ability to block every account on a rage. User:Alison has said this many times while taunting User:Grawp and his sockpuppets, and has displayed the ability to block hundreds of accounts on the same range in a single minute. When performing such an action there is the possibility of HUGE collateral damage of innocent accounts being caught in the mass block. I know this for a fact because I have been caught in these mass blocks several times —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.44.55.2 (talk) 13:33, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Connect the following

Can anyone tell me exactly how the following are connected? Cape Cobras, Diamond Eagles, Otago Volts, Sussex Sharks, Somerset Sabres, and Wayamba..... Thanks in advance!117.194.231.176 (talk) 16:43, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Please do your own homework.
Welcome to the Wikipedia Reference Desk. Your question appears to be a homework question. I apologize if this is a misinterpretation, but it is our aim here not to do people's homework for them, but to merely aid them in doing it themselves. Letting someone else do your homework does not help you learn nearly as much as doing it yourself. Please attempt to solve the problem or answer the question yourself first. If you need help with a specific part of your homework, feel free to tell us where you are stuck and ask for help. If you need help grasping the concept of a problem, by all means let us know. Comet Tuttle (talk) 16:51, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's not a homework question, if you must know. I came across this question in an answer and win column in the paper yesterday, and I've already sent my response. I just wanted to cross check my answer here on Wikipedia. Besides, what sort of school would set a dumb question like this for homework?? 117.194.231.176 (talk) 16:56, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It's not a homework question but extremely easy to answer with a search. Since I didn't have to search to answer though I'll be generous and suggest you look at 2009 Champions League Twenty20. P.S. If you already knew couldn't you just check yourself or at least give us your answer? Nil Einne (talk) 17:02, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Quite so! If it were such a "dumb question" then what would the need be to make a post asking for the answer? ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 17:55, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I think by dumb 117 meant academically pointless. —Akrabbimtalk 18:15, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Is there such a thing as pointless academic research? See Blue skies research ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 18:35, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The academy doesn't always think so, but I think most people would agree there is, especially when public funds are required to sustain it... --Mr.98 (talk) 21:20, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
It's interesting that you mention "most people". In my own day-to-day experiences most people are ignorant, under-educated, bigots. Maybe I need to move house. ~~ Dr Dec (Talk) ~~ 21:35, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Or at least lighten up. --Mr.98 (talk) 22:18, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What is the prize? If you win what will you contribute to Wikipedia in gratitude? Cuddlyable3 (talk) 17:13, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What I meant by "dumb" is that school students aren't going to score marks in any exam by knowing the answer to this question. My answer (the one I sent to the newspaper before coming to the Ref Desk) was that all of them were first-class cricket teams. The reason I got my answer wrong was that every time I did a Google search, I entered a single name, instead of the names of all the teams together, the result of which was reading their respective articles on Wikipedia, instead of coming to know how to they were related. And since I only had enough patience to read only the first three teams' articles, I saw the apparent connection -- that all of them were cricket teams. It was only later that I realised that I might've been mistaken. Everyone happy?? Oh, and the prize is supposed to be an audio CD... not much for a donation... haha... You ended up asking more questions than you answered... 117.194.227.89 (talk) 07:54, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Portland, Maine and suburbs

Does Portland, Maine have suburbs? Heegoop, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes. Why would you imagine a city with 62,000 residents, would not have suburbs? Portland, Maine#Neighborhoods has a list. Other places within the wider urban area that I would also consider Portland's suburbs, include South Portland, Falmouth and Westbrook, though these are actually separate cities Astronaut (talk) 23:33, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Also see Portland-South Portland-Biddeford metropolitan area. —Akrabbimtalk 23:34, 19 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Astronaut appears to be applying a British English definition of suburb to an American city. Akrabbim's answer is the one an American would expect. Rmhermen (talk) 04:40, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Others[11][12][13] seem to share Astronaut's definition. Clarityfiend (talk) 05:15, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

October 20

Surrogacy

When women use donor eggs or surrogate mothers to have children, who is the baby genetically related to; the woman carrying the baby or the woman the egg came from? Who does it look like? Is it related to both women? (Not requesting medical advice). --124.254.77.148 (talk) 05:37, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is only genetically related to the woman who provided the egg. The surrogate mother is basically only an incubator for the egg, and provides no actual genetic material for the child. --Jayron32 05:43, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That being said, the mother carrying the child will still greatly affect the child if carried to term. The amount and type of nutrients, hormones, steroids, and other products (alcohol, nicotine, etc.) she ingests during gestation will greatly influence the child. And, if you believe Clive Barker, music. ~ Amory (utc) 13:26, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Flushing water mains

There's a town near me that puts up little signs at busy intersections to notify the residents about the water mains being flushed soon. This is the only town that I've ever seen put up such signs. Is this a yearly thing that all water systems go through and other places just don't bother to inform the populace in such ways? Or does this town maybe have some water system that requires a flush every year? And finally, what's the point of flushing the water mains yearly? FYI, this is in the US state of Vermont. Dismas|(talk) 05:44, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The town I live in (Northern Illinois, USA) does the same sort of thing, though the signs read "Hydrant flushing". My understanding is that this is an effort to flush sediment from the pipes. here's a page that gives an official answer. –RHolton10:07, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]


Compact Disks

how did compact discs create new business opportunites? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Christina hamby (talkcontribs) 13:38, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What was before? Who bought them? What kinds of equipment (if any) were needed to go with them? What sales and manufacturing jobs were created? Think along those lines, and you will find the answers coming quickly.
You have a brain. So, exercise it. It will help you in life and may even help avoid Alzheimer's Disease later.209.244.187.155 (talk) 14:19, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

want a article on HOW MS -OFFICE USED IN BUSSINESS & INDUSTRY".

I want a article on HOW MS -OFFICE USED IN BUSSINESS & INDUSTRY". and also want a ppt on this tropic. Prasenjitghosh (talk) 13:43, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

So make them. This, however, is not the place to get others to do your work for you, whether homework or your job. ~ Amory (utc) 14:05, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Microsoft Office is one of the most popular software packages ever produced, and is extremely widely used in all sections of industry. I suggest having a closer look at what Office does. That will explain how it's used in industry. For example MS-Word is good for writing documents. And as for preparing a Powerpoint, well what package are you going to use to prepare that? DJ Clayworth (talk) 14:09, 20 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

London web cams

I've looked but all I can find are static images of london. Anyone know any "live" web cams where you actually see shit moving then just still images. thanks


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