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Talk:Hurricane Laura: Difference between revisions

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This article is written in American English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, defense, traveled) and some terms that are used in it may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.

A news item involving Hurricane Laura was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 27 August 2020.

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• https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?v=316930336052120
• https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=596180611057616
• https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=256356088653454

video2commons appears to be down, otherwise i'd migrate these PD videos myself! Victor Grigas (talk) 23:12, 26 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Victorgrigas: Great job! Just make sure they're not copyrighted and you mention the NOAA hurricane hunters. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 01:56, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@ChessEric: Please stop changing the lead sentence to something so sensational, even if that wording is used by the NHC. This is absolutely not the WP:TONE we should be presenting in articles.--Jasper Deng (talk) 05:29, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

According to the experts Laura is a sensational event --exactly the situation in which "peacock" is reserved for. Rjensen (talk) 09:22, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Rjensen: It's the tone that is sensational in this case. I have no problems with saying Laura itself is sensational.--Jasper Deng (talk) 15:22, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

It is more violent than the Hurricane Katrina (lastampa.it. There exists a metereological forecast saying that "with top winds of 150 mph, Laura is a high-end Category 4, only 7 mph below a Category 5 hurricane." (CNN.com). Philosopher81sp (talk) 16:48, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• https://www.star.nesdis.noaa.gov/GOES/floater.php?stormid=AL132020#homePageLink

Victor Grigas (talk) 14:48, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I got some reliable source form CBS and others that Laura is a Category 4 Hurricane but why isn't it changed in the infobox yet even though the contributors mentioned it in the body. Is there a reason? Should we change it? Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs) 15:10, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Kartsriv: That infobox shows the current storm status. It was a Category 4 hurricane but isn't anymore.--Jasper Deng (talk) 15:21, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Jasper Deng: What about this Article? Is the current data outdated? Thanks Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs) 15:29, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Kartsriv: It hit as a cat 4, but has since weakened. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 16:39, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Destroyeraa: But the articles I mentioned are posted hardly minutes ago... Maybe be the Hurricane has regained its strength!? Not an expert when it comes to geographical stuff rather just a nice guy trying to provide accurate information to people. Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs)

@Kartsriv: For Wikipedia's purposes, the data for the intensity of the hurricane/tropical cyclone always comes from the NHC or other such RSMC/TCWC, not news articles which maybe outdated or talking in the past tense when being published. At the moment, NHC is saying that Laura has weakened from a Category 4 at its peak intensity into a tropical storm and is forecasting it to continue weakening - as a result, there is practically no chance of Laura regaining its strength as a Category 4 hurricane. Hope this helps. :) Jason Rees (talk) 17:10, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Jason Rees: Thank you for clarifying this. I actually learned something today. Here after will follow the NHC for similar events. Call me Karthik 😉🤞 (talk • contribs)

As of 17:41 UTC someone has 'downgraded' Laura to a Tropical Storm in the article. The BBC are still reporting it as Category 2 and NOAA are listing it as a hurricane. It seems that someone has been foolish, given that accurate information on the status of Laura is important to people in northern Louisiana. Stub Mandrel (talk) 17:43, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Stub Mandrel: Most news articles take time to catch up to the NHC. At 12:00 CDT, the NHC downgraded Laura to a Tropical Storm. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 17:47, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Stub Mandrel: As noted above, we take the information for the hurricane intensity on Wikipedia from the US National Hurricane Center (Which is a part of NOAA) and other RSMC/TCWC's directly rather than news reports like the BBC.Jason Rees (talk) 17:51, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Stub Mandrel:@Destroyeraa:@Jason Rees: I'm sorry, but I'm appalled by your comment of me being "foolish." I use ONLY the NHC, CPHC, and JTWC for ACCURATE information on ALL tropical cyclones. So for you to say that I'm "foolishly" adding in information when this article and the section for it on the main hurricane season page has been vandalized NUMEROUS times and all I've been doing is adding reliable information with sources EVERY SINGLE TIME is VERY offensive and I'd like an apology.ChessEric (talk) 21:47, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I can't figure out why the article says this at the top but this is the edit that introduced it: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hurricane_Laura&diff=next&oldid=974613339 . Someone who knows how should remove this. Baldersmash (talk) 19:43, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Baldersmash: Laura’s still active. ChessEric added a template that says that this is a current event. Do not remove until the storm dissipated. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 21:36, 27 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Section Impact - United States - Louisiana begins with a srange word: umerous (sic). Please, fix this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.6.89.97 (talk) 15:34, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@190.6.89.97: Should be fixed now. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 17:00, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. Good work. Just wondering about why Katrina isn't on the US list of strongest landfall tropical cyclones for Louisiana. Thanks. Pasdecomplot (talk) 12:14, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Pasdecomplot: it definitely is, Katrina is top of the list for landfalling TCs in Louisiana when looking at minimum pressure, and tied for fifth in terms of 1-minute sustained winds. For comparison, Laura is fourth for pressure and tied for first for winds. ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 14:12, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@KN2731: I was referring to an excel chart with a list of historical cyclones. Doesn't seem to be in the article now. No worries. Thanks for responding.Pasdecomplot11:31, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hey there. I just created a draft - Draft:Meteorological history of Hurricane Laura, since some users had an incentive to create such an article. It's gonna take some time to finish it, and by the time it's finished, Laura would've dissipated. Therefore, it's written not in the present tense (Laura is a currently active tropical depression that is affecting...) but in the past tense (Laura was the a deadly tropical cyclone that is tied for the record of the strongest landfalling hurricane in Louisiana...) - something like that. Anyone good at writing met history articles? ~ Destroyeraa🌀 16:59, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I am! Can I help? Hurricanehuron33 (talk) 21:56, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Hurricanehuron33: Of course you can help! It will be appreciated by the community. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 23:07, 28 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Destroyeraa: I'd advise to build the article slowly so as not to create more work for yourself down the road, since it'll likely require significant revision once NHC releases their tropical cyclone report some time next year, but don't let this stop you from finishing it if you happen to find enough momentum. ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 10:21, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@KN2731: Yes, I’ve thought about that, but the MH section in the TCR only requires some revision of the draft. Just some pressure fixes, time fixes, and wind speed fixes won’t be too much of a problem. Getting the basic structure down currently. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 15:51, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I just rewrite the entire met hist and I don't really think it needs or can support a sub-article at this point. The only real period of note is the two days it spent over the Gulf, but info from the NHC is surprisingly bland. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 20:31, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Cyclonebiskit: As KN said, maybe we should wait until the TCR comes out? I think for such a powerful storm as Laura, it really deserves a MH article. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 22:35, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Should we remove the link to Hurricane Marco#Preparations? Though at a point, both Laura and Marco were to hit as hurricanes, but Marco eventually degenerated into a weak tropical storm when it made landfall. It literally did nothing, and the preparations for Marco were less than impressive. Unlike Laura, the National Guard, state troopers, and evacuation crews were not initiated. Evacuation was only mandatory in a few counties in Mississippi, compared to most of southern Louisiana, southwestern Texas, and western Mississippi was evacuated due to Laura. What do you guys think? Oppose? Support? Comment? ~ Destroyeraa🌀 00:41, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi:

Just found this link to a first estimation of the insured damages in the US, excluding Puerto Rio, at 8 to 12 billions $US: https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/28/business/hurricane-laura-economic-impact/index.html

Pierre cb (talk) 03:16, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Pierre cb: For damages, we need an exact estimate, such as $10 million, not a rough estimate of $8-12 million, as I explained to Dannisom. Damage isn't done yet, so we need to wait at least another week until AON or KarenCo gives their estimates. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 13:58, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The $8 to 12 billion damage total is already in the article. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 14:12, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Hurricanehink and Pierre cb: As with Isaias, the rough estimate given (for Isaias) came out a two or three days after the storm hit. It was estimated at $1-12 billion in damages. The actual estimate - $4.2 billion - came out 1 to 2 weeks after the storm hit. Will probably wait until an exact estimate for Laura, though it can take weeks. Though you can keep the >$8 billion, though it is vague and unspecific, and will probably need AON or KarenCo to give the specifics. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 16:20, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Oh ok also can i add the Wettest known hurricane to striem Haiti because laura was 7th wettest Dannisom (talk) 16:27, 29 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that estimates should be a specific number and we should wait until we have more solid figures. As the flooding goes down insurance companies will go in and do actual assessments, and as a result, we will have better numbers. In regards to the wettest storm question, so long as it is sourced and cited correctly, I don't have an issue with this update. Jurisdicta (talk) 16:53, 1 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The Fort Polk radar was not destroyed, please update the article. See source: https://www.facebook.com/NEXRADROC/posts/3786620181370863 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.4.104.114 (talk) 08:10, 2 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The article currently doesn't mention climate change. I've noticed this in more articles about tropical cyclones, whose meteorological history is consistent with trends expected by climate change, and who are directly linked by climate scientist to climate change. In the case of Laura, quite a few scientists have chimed in here.^[1][2][3] Laura's Rapid intensification and the location of making landfall are consistent with climate change, according to these climatologists: driven by high sea surface temperatures. Before I start crafting a few sentences, I was wondering if there is some consensus to omit the potential underlying cause of tropical cyclone intensification before an official attribution and detection study has been performed? Femke Nijsse (talk) 09:18, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There isn't any consensus to omit the potential underlying cause of tropical cyclone intensification as far as I am aware, however, I personally feel that it would be better to have an article talking about tropical cyclones and climate change rather than a section speculating about Laura's relation to climate change. After all, the media likes to trot out articles talking about Climate Change after every significant tropical cyclone and no single tropical cyclone can yet be directly attributed to climate change.Jason Rees (talk) 10:36, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jason Rees, thanks for your response. We have an article about tropical cyclones and climate change, which I'm desperately trying to get in a less horrible state based on actual scientific sources. And yes, some media are making claims that are way too strong. However I disagree with your statement that linking climate change and Laura is speculation. Increased sea level temperatures are very confidently attributed to climate change, and to rapid intensification of tropical cyclones. I'm not proposing to say climate change caused Laura of course, simply that the background state made storms like Laura more likely to occur.

There is actually quite a bit of research attributing changes in tropical cyclones to climate change, for instance for Hurricane Florence^[4] and Hurricane Harvey^[5] Femke Nijsse (talk) 10:49, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered=or|ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

The article about planes that fly into hurricanes is called Hurricane hunters, not Hurricane Hunters. The capital letters make them sound like an organization, but apparently "hurricane hunters" is just a description. Please replace "Hurricane Hunters" with "hurricane hunters" or "Hurricane hunters" as appropriate. Thank you. 64.203.187.108 (talk) 15:37, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

aight Hurricanehuron33 (talk) 16:46, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done! ~ Destroyeraa🌀 17:10, 31 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

In the Impacts section under Louisiana the article states The NWS radar at Fort Polk was also destroyed This is very incorrect, as the radar in Polk still exists and is downed by a communication outage, as stated by the source, could somebody fix this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.196.99.188 (talk) 01:14, 4 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I was able to verify that the radar station at Fort Polk is indeed online and was not destroyed. Fort Polk, NWS LA Radar reading Jurisdicta (talk) 02:16, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done Jurisdicta (talk) 02:19, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered=or|ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

> Most of the watches were upgraded to warnings the next day and a flash flood watch was also issued for the western half of the state as over 10 inches (25 cm) of rain was expected

Please change to mm. Centimeters are not used for rainfall 93.136.196.224 (talk) 01:47, 4 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

 Done Danski454 (talk) 13:58, 4 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I had to re fix everything that got sabotaged by people that thought it reached Cat 5. Rmagnan (talk) 07:22, 7 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

For the moment, at least, protection is not needed. The edits claiming it was a Category 5 only came from one IP. TornadoLGS (talk) 17:03, 7 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Rmagnan and TornadoLGS: I have requested infinite semi-protection for Laura's page at Wikipedia:Requests_for_page_protection#Hurricane_Laura. Vandalism has been on the increase over the past days. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 14:58, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I'm no expert on TC stylisation and formatting on WP, though regularly view the pages. I found the lead "The twelfth named storm, fourth hurricane, and first major hurricane of the 2020 Atlantic hurricane season..." to be somewhat jarring, as "Fourth Hurricane" doesn't sit very well with me. Of course Hurricane Laura was the fourth storm to reach hurricane strength, as Marco became a hurricane first. I don't necessarily think a rewording is justified or required, but is the time of strengthening to a certain status (ie hurricane) common in declaring an ordinal (first, second, third...) position for a hurricane, or is it's naming order taken as priority making the lead incorrect? It's not necessarily wrong, or bad, and again may not warrant change - in fact I'm probably the problem - but I found it ambiguous to the point I'd wish to raise it nonetheless. 14.201.169.111 (talk) 15:16, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@14.201.169.111: That is usually how it is written on tropical cyclone articles, at least in my experience. ~ Destroyeraa🌀 15:26, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Destroyeraa: Awesome, thanks for your time resolving this for me, and effort in the community at large. 14.201.169.111 (talk) 16:01, 9 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

"Multiple homes also were uninhabitable due to air conditioning units being destroyed."

Not mentioned in the source and sounds a little weird. What is mentioned is that a hospital won't be able to reopen because they can't keep their equipment sterile without air conditioning. 93.136.94.63 (talk) 04:23, 17 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hi:

May I have the reference for this "A total of 32 fatalities occurred throughout the state with four of them coming from falling trees."? As far as I can have official references, there is only 27 death in Louisiana according to the Departement of HealT (https://ldh.la.gov/index.cfm/newsroom/detail/5761).

Pierre cb (talk) 12:35, 26 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]