Contents

Talk:John Adams/GA1

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch

Reviewer: SNUGGUMS (talk · contribs) 01:39, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I will review. Expect comments within a week. Snuggums (talk / edits) 01:39, 30 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry for the delay; got sidetracked with other activities both inside and outside of Wikipedia. Will post when the review is complete. Snuggums (talk / edits) 02:53, 6 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Not to worry. Considerable cleaning up done in the interim. Hoppyh (talk) 14:03, 9 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I have completed my attempt to respond to review items. My thanks again for the GA review of Adams - I believe all efforts have brought significant improvement. Hoppyh (talk) 19:40, 25 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox

• Keep his birth location simple by just using modern location, which is Quincy, Massachusetts
• If I'm going to be honest, it doesn't make sense to list some children's names and not others

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 13:47, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Lead

• Given that his father was John Adams, Sr., the article should note that Adams was a Jr.
• The description "an exceptional diarist" might come off as puffery
• "He as well often"..... also
• Is "seminal" in "seminal ideas" the best description? I have a feeling people will get the wrong idea with this term
• "older" in "older cousin" isn't really needed
• "He was an excellent judge of character" is a biased statement and unnecessary to begin with
• It's worth including the years (1789 to 1797) that he served as Vice President under Washington
• "Adams was defeated by Thomas Jefferson and retired to Massachusetts" should end with a period, not a semi-colon
• "through a notable correspondence spanning fourteen years" reads awkwardly, and editorializations like "notable" shouldn't be included
• What is "accomplished" in "accomplished politicians, diplomats, and historians" supposed to mean?
• "Adams was the father of John Quincy Adams, the sixth President of the United States" should be its own sentence

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 00:20, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Early life and education

Childhood

• I would mention his brothers Peter and Elihu by name
• "twenty years junior to Deacon Adams" is unnecessary detail and not exactly true when John Sr. was born in 1961 and Susanna was born in 1708
• "responded in a remarkably positive way"..... keep it simple and say "responded positively"

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 01:38, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Law practice and marriage

• Add a comma after "Five days before his 29th birthday"
• "married Abigail Smith (1744–1818), his third cousin" → "married his third cousin Abigail Smith (1744–1818)"
• Replace the semi-colon after "1764" with a period.
• Any particular reason Abigail's father is mentioned while her mother isn't?

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 01:50, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Diplomat In Europe

Commissioner to France/Minister Plenipotentiary

• Not sure if this subsection's title complies with WP:SLASH
• "Adams was a logical choice for colonial diplomacy" is vague and not really needed to begin with
• "Thus he assumed" → "He therefore assumed"

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 15:37, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Ambassador to Great Britain

• "When he was presented to his former sovereign, George III, the King intimated that he was aware of Adams' lack of confidence in the French government. Adams admitted this, stating: 'I must avow to your Majesty that I have no attachment but to my own country.'" is unreferenced

Quote moved to talk p. until reference found. Hoppyh (talk) 18:25, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "Queen Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom referred to this episode on July 7, 1976, at the White House. She said"..... overkill, just go with Queen Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom later recalled

Better, I think. Hoppyh (talk) 18:37, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "They returned to the United States in 1788 aboard the Lucretia; the Adams' home in England, a house off London's Grosvenor Square, still stands and is commemorated by a plaque" needs a citation

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 18:37, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Vice Presidency

• "start of the first vice presidential term; however, Congress" → "start of the first vice presidential term, though Congress"
• I would note that Washington officially was sworn in on April 30, 1789
• "He was reelected Vice President in 1792" and "Washington seldom asked Adams for input on policy and legal issues during his tenure as vice president" should be separate sentences, not divided by a semicolon
• "On at least one occasion, he persuaded senators to vote against legislation that he opposed, and he frequently lectured the Senate on procedural and policy matters. Adams' political views and his attempt to assume a more active role in the Senate made him a natural target for critics of the Washington administration. Toward the end of his first term, as a result of a threatened resolution that would have silenced him except for procedural and policy matters, he began to exercise more restraint. When the nation's first two opposing political parties formed, he joined the Federalist Party, but never got on well with its dominant leader Alexander Hamilton." is uncited
• "frustrating experiences for a man of his vigor, intellect, and vanity"...... keep it simple and just say "frustrating experiences for him"

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 18:54, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Presidential Election of 1796

• The entire first paragraph is unsourced
• "silly and wicked" from "what he called the silly and wicked game" should be in quotation marks
• "Adams vowed he would resign if elected to the second place spot of vice-president under Jefferson" needs a source

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 19:08, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Presidency

1797–1801

• "George Herring, a noted historian" → "Historian George Herring"
• "Indeed" should be removed since it is too informal for a Wikipedia article (unless part of a quote or title)

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 19:19, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Quasi-War and peace with France

• The entire second paragraph is unreferenced

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 19:29, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Speeches

• I'm not sure this list is really necessary, and it certainly doesn't require short subsections (which are discouraged per MOS:PARAGRAPHS)

 Done Moved to talk p. - no other presidents include this. Hoppyh (talk) 20:04, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Judicial appointments

Supreme court

• "One of Adams' greatest legacies was his naming of John Marshall"..... just say "Adams named John Marshall" for the sake of simplicity and neutrality
• Not sure if "Adams first offered the post to John Jay who declined" is necessary detail

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 20:04, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Retirement

• "Sixteen months before John Adams' death, his son, John Quincy Adams, became the sixth president of the United States (1825–1829), the only son to succeed father the until George W. Bush in 2001" is missing a citation

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 20:25, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Death

• "Astonishingly, on Tuesday, July 4, 1826"..... I'm not sure if "astonishingly" is encyclopedic, and the day of week is unnecessary detail, so just go with "On July 4, 1826".
• "Relatives who were at his bedside reported that his last words were 'Jefferson survives'; news of Jefferson's death earlier that day did not reach Boston until after Adams' death. Adams and Jefferson are the only two Presidents to die on the same day; their deaths left Charles Carroll as the last surviving signer of the Declaration" is unnecessary detail

 Done Image may need adj. Hoppyh (talk) 20:36, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Biographies

• "first notable biography" is unnecessary editorializing
• It's worth noting that Charles Francis Adams, Sr. was Adams' grandson
• "Peter Shaw" links to a DAB page, please fix this
• "its graceful prose" is completely biased and unnecessary
• "In 2001, the popular historian David McCullough published a large biography, also entitled John Adams, that won various awards and general acclaim. McCullough's biography was the basis for a 2008 TV miniseries, in which Paul Giamatti portrayed John Adams. Finance writer James Grant published John Adams, Party of One in 2005." needs to be cited, and no need for "popular"

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 21:21, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Ancestry

• This isn't really needed when the majority of the people listed don't even have their own articles, and any mention of prominent ancestors is better for article prose.

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 21:37, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

See also

• Why is "Hannah Adams" linked here without any previous connection?

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 23:55, 21 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

References

• Several dead links

 Done Hoppyh (talk) 03:26, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• All dates and accessdates should be in MDY format per MOS:DATE since this is a US subject

 Done (I think I got them all.) Hoppyh (talk) 14:34, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• All citations to book references should have page numbers; there are several that have only chapter numbers instead

Ferling references account for this - all originated with my edits. I employed the ebook version of that source, which prevents use of page refs - see suggestion at WP:Page numbers. Hoppyh (talk) 21:55, 24 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Overall

• Well-written?

• Prose quality: Decent, but could be better
• Manual of Style compliance: Mostly good

Work in progress Hoppyh (talk) 14:37, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Dashes have been fixed by another editor – Hooray. Hoppyh (talk) 13:12, 23 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Verifiable?

• Reference layout: Several date formatting issues
• Reliable sources: All good
• No original research: Some text is missing references, and dead links make things harder to verify

• Broad in coverage?

• Major aspects: Almost
• Focused Some excess detail needs to be removed

Work in progress Hoppyh (talk) 18:11, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Neutral?: Needs a bit of POV-cleaning

Work in progress Hoppyh (talk) 18:11, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Stable?: All recent changes have only been to improve the article, no ongoing updates or content disputes

• Illustrated, if possible, by images?

• Appropriate licensing: No copyright issues
• Relevance and captioning: I'm not sure how File:Capture of the French Privateer Sandwich by armed Marines on the Sloop Sally, from the U.S. Frigate Constitution, Puerto.jpg, File:Boston Massacre.jpg, File:Passport John Adams Benjamin Franklin John Jay Ministers Plenipotentiary 1783.jpg, or File:United First Parish Church, Quincy, MA.jpg are particularly beneficial.

 Done First image above (naval battle-Quasi War) replaced with XYZ Affair cartoon - others removed. Hoppyh (talk) 16:43, 22 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Pass or Fail?: I've decided to put this on hold for seven days. Prose quality and unsourced text are my main concerns at the moment. Snuggums (talk / edits) 23:33, 20 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Article is now good. Passing! Snuggums (talk / edits) 03:59, 26 September 2015 (UTC)[reply]