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Sirikit Kitiyakara -> Sirikit, Queen of Thailand
I think this would be better than the current article name. CW32 13:43, 17 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Sirikit Kitiyakara -> Queen Sirikit of Thailand
per Wiki convention on the naming of current royal spouses; this is how she is best known to the world at present and for the last several decades. Mowens35 20:09, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
PS I am Bangkok for the next few days. If any Thai Wikipedians are about, I would be interested in discussing this and other questions, so feel free to email me (adam@carringbush.net). Adam 13:16, 18 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
(Not a vote)Please don't vote on moving individual articles. We need a consistent policy. Mark1 04:21, 24 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
The votes above were inconclusive. No consensus. Tags removed. 217.140.193.123 22:43, 24 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Could the recent Thai editor clarify whether Somdej Phra Nangchao Sirikit Phra Boromarajininat is part of her name, an alternate version of her name, or a title - if it is a title, what does it mean and why is it in italics?
Also, surely the King's service as a monk was longer than 15 days? I thought six months to a year was the usual period.
Adam 04:46, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
It is her current title conferred upon by the King on completion of her regency. This is the name by which she should now be called. It effectively replaces her former name and title, in the same way as e.g. 'King George VI' replaced the name of 'Prince Albert of York'. The symantically closest translation of this name is probably "Her Majesty Queen Regent Sirikit" (literal translation in this case would not be exact, as a few praising words were added : "Majestic Lady Sirikit, Great Queen [who has] Ruled"). As this is a long foreign word within English text, I decided to italicised it. Please amend accordingly if this is in conflict with the current preferred style.
I confirm the King's ordained period as 15 days, between October 22 to November 5, 1956. Normal period of monkhood for Thai men is three months, during the lent period, but this is by no mean fixed. Most noble people or people who are in high office who enter a 'token' period of monkhood normally spend between one to two weeks only. Unfortunately, all the information about this I can find on the web at the moment are in Thai. See, for example:
http://www.police.go.th/king11.html
Oops -- Sorry, forgot to sign. --Jakris 11:47, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Could I also add that, as Kitiyakara is her maiden name, this should be removed from the part of her name, now that she had married to the King. If anything, her surname is now Mahidol, although she would never be known by this. My understanding is that only the deceased queen consorts would be referred to by maiden name to avoid confusion due to lack of ordinal. Wikipedia refers to the current queen consorts by titles and first names only. (See e.g. Silvia of Sweden). --Jakris 12:19, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
I would not want "Kitiyakara" to be in the heading. Rather, something like Sirikit Rajini would be better, to reflect her truly used name, position. After all, living consorts are something like Queen Sophia of Spain. 217.140.193.123 22:26, 23 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Somdej Phra Boromarajininat (สมเด็จพระบรมราชินีนาถ -- the Queen Regent) is the highest rank among the royal wives. Holder of this title must have acted as a regent. (The word "nat" at the end of the title means "ruler".) This title is normally used in the form of:
or
As for the current Queen of Thailand, her name has been retained, thus: Somdej Phra Nangchao Sirikit Phra Boromarajininat. 217.140.193.123 22:26, 23 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
I do not think the word 'ennoble' would be the most appropriate word here: Mom Chao Nakhatra Mongkol was born noble. There are three broad classes of 'princes' in Thai royalty: "Chao Pha" being the most prestigious, followed by "Phra Ong Chao", and then "Mom Chao" being the most junior. ("Mom Rajawongse" and "Mom Luang" who are children and grand-children of "Mom Chao", although retaining these titles to signify they royal ancestry, are considered commoners.) "Mom Chao" Nakhatra Mongkol would therefore still be classified as a prince by birth, albeit a junior one. What the King did was to gave him a feudal title of "Kromma-mhun Chandaburi Suranat" (normally translated as "Prince of Chandaburi" -- literally "Baron Chandaburi, the Brave Ruler") and elevated him one step further to the equivalence of "Phra Ong Chao" class, although this was not made explicit in the name. --Jakris 12:19, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Dear oh dear, the more I think I know about Thai titles the less it turns out I actually know. Perhaps we should have an article on Thai royal and noble titles. Anyway I have tried to incorporate your comments in the text. Further down it says She performed her duties so satisfactorily that she was given the title "Somdech Phraboroma Rajininath." This seems to contradict the titles you gave. Adam 13:10, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Not really. "Somdech Phraboroma Rajininath" is actually a rank ("Queen Regent"), whereas her full style is what I've given.
As for the article you propose, I was thinking about that as well, but could not think of an appropriate heading. Now that you've mentioned, I'll try to sort it out. --Jakris 13:20, 6 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Sorry I was not very clear. Although her title in Thai conveys the meaning of queen regent, the word "Regent" itself does not make its way to the official translation of her name, and she is formally known in English as "Her Majesty Queen Sirikit".
I've also added a several links to the 'Title' article. --Jakris 23:12, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)
OK, thanks for that. This article is now much improved. Kopkun krub. Adam 02:25, 8 Mar 2005 (UTC)
i´m trying to get a discussion going to change the rules on naming consorts, monarchs, etc.. it´s a bit of mess at the moment. maybe you wanna join in and give your opinion? feel free [1] cheers Antares911 23:38, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Please consult Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style (Thailand-related articles)#Cast votes
What is that? I know that Rajini means Queen, but why it is the title of this article? CW32 15:31, 30 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
When I first wrote this article, I called it Sirikit Kitiyakara, since that appeared to be her name. What was wrong with that? Adam 09:21, 27 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
If we follow the pattern of all other queens consort, this article ought to be called Queen Sirikit of Thailand. See Queen Sofia of Spain, Empress Michiko of Japan, Queen Rania of Jordan, Queen Silvia of Sweden, Queen Sonja of Norway, Queen Paola of Belgium. Adam 10:20, 27 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Why is Thailand exempt from the naming pattern for other queens consort demonstrated above? "Queen Sirikit" is her most common name in English, and Queen Sirikit of Thailand is simple, not incorrect and conforms to the Wikipedia pattern. What is the objection to this? Adam 06:20, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Of course this is the place for this discussion - where else should it be conducted? And you are wrong. This naming pattern is not for disambiguation. Queen Sofia of Spain, Empress Michiko of Japan, Queen Rania of Jordan, Queen Silvia of Sweden, Queen Sonja of Norway and Queen Paola of Belgium need no disambiguation. This is the standard Wikipedia naming pattern for queens consort (wives of kings). I ask again, why should this article not conform to it? Adam 09:46, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I have no idea what you are talking about. It is agreed that this article needs to be renamed, and I am pointing out that there is an established Wikipedia convention for queens consort, which is Queen X of Y. I am asking, why should this article not be renamed to conform to that convention? Rather than trying to attribute sinister motives to me, why don't you answer the question? Adam 12:24, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Prsgoddess187 13:34, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]I really don't see why this has become such a contentious matter. The article needs to be renamed. I have suggested an alternative name. I still haven't heard any objection to the alternative name, other than that I have suggested it. Adam 14:02, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Istill don't know what Henry's objection is to Queen Sirikit of Thailand, other than accusations about what happened in the previous round of debate. I have read over that debate and I see that I didn't in fact vote one way or the other. I did argue that it was disrespectful to style the Queen of Thailand simply Sirikit, and I still think that is a relevant consideration. Adam 00:55, 29 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I defer to Patiwat - if Thai editors think Sirikit is acceptable I have no objection. Adam 04:24, 29 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I'm almost afraid to tell Patiwat that Sirikit is a very common name for Siamese cats in Australia - my mother had one. Adam 04:45, 29 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 07:48, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Both the king and Sirikit signed their name in their marriage licenses is poor English, and is trivial compared to the fact she was not yet 18 and her parents also signed — line 12 directly under her signature on line 11 − of what should be called certificate of marriage ทะเบียนการสมรส. Reproductions of it are sold as souvenirs, and can be found on-line by searching for it by its common name, ใบสมรส สิริกิติ์ --Pawyilee (talk) 15:04, 14 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Former Reuters journalist Andrew MacGregor Marshall resigns from his post in Thailand to publish the Thailand Expose, uncovering the actual political situation in Thailand, in which Sirikit seems to play a significant role. The story is also covered in other media such as The Independent and Atlantic Wire among others. The expose seems to be a rich source for this article, as well as for the article "Politics of Thailand". Hence, I posted this also on the Talk:Politics_of_Thailand page. --spitzl (talk) 12:43, 24 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]
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There seems to be some confusion in this article whether the person is Queen Consort or Queen Regent. Could someone shed light on this please. Mootros (talk) 05:09, 1 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Done! removed the misleading part from the box that is meant to be link to succession. Mootros (talk) 09:24, 5 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Strangely, there is no mention in this article of the fact that Bhumibol is a first-cousin once removed of his wife, Sirikit, the two being respectively a grandson and a great-granddaughter of Chulalongkorn. It's a bit confusing, especially when we can read such things as "Both Bhumibol and Sirikit found much common ground on their likes and dislikes and thus began a relationship" which make us think that they are not at all related.Sultan Rahi (talk) 06:42, 2 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The term exists. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.100.251.67 (talk) 16:37, 10 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Is she not known as the Queen Mother? RhysHoffman 11:50, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
In certain sections of this article, which seems to have been edited a few days ago, mention is made of 'her husband' meaning the late king Rama IX. However, since her husband died more than two years ago, the whole article needs editing to reflect this reality. Abul Bakhtiar (talk) 14:27, 11 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 03:02, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
