Contents

Talk:Aurangzeb

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Aurangzeb article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Article policies Neutral point of view No original research Verifiability

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1, 2Auto-archiving period: 30 days

This  level-4 vital article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Biography: Politics and Government / Royalty and Nobility This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles This article is supported by the politics and government work group (assessed as Mid-importance). This article is supported by WikiProject Royalty and Nobility. Afghanistan High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Afghanistan, a project to maintain and expand Afghanistan-related subjects on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.AfghanistanWikipedia:WikiProject AfghanistanTemplate:WikiProject AfghanistanAfghanistan articles High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Bangladesh High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Bangladesh, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Bangladesh on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.BangladeshWikipedia:WikiProject BangladeshTemplate:WikiProject BangladeshBangladesh articles High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. The article falls into the work area of the History workgroup of WikiProject Bangladesh WikiProject Bangladesh To-do list: edit history watch purge Add more images to Bangladesh Liberation War and related pages Clean up Climate change in Bangladesh, it needs a lot of work Clean up History of Bangladesh after independence, it needs NPOV Improve Bangladesh back to FA as it was demoted (see discussion) Improve Bengali language back to FA as it was demoted (see discussion) Improve Bengalis and related pages Take a look at the requested articles. Make a MRT line 3 article. Extend, add an infobox and a map of New Eskaton to New Eskaton. India: History High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject India, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of India-related topics. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page.IndiaWikipedia:WikiProject IndiaTemplate:WikiProject IndiaIndia articles High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. This article is supported by the Indian history workgroup (assessed as High-importance). This article was last assessed in May 2012. Pakistan High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pakistan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pakistan on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PakistanWikipedia:WikiProject PakistanTemplate:WikiProject PakistanPakistan articles High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Please stay calm and civil while commenting or presenting evidence, and do not make personal attacks. Be patient when approaching solutions to any issues. If consensus is not reached, other solutions exist to draw attention and ensure that more editors mediate or comment on the dispute.

A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on July 31, 2012.

Change the following text "In 1675 the 9th Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur was arrested on orders by Aurangzeb and later execute after he refused to Convert in Islam," to "In 1675 the 9th Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur was arrested on orders by Aurangzeb and later executed after he refused to Convert in Islam. " Mohib Alvi 22:00, 13 August 2023 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mohibalvi (talk • contribs)

 Already done SKAG123 (talk) 19:29, 7 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@RegentsPark: The lead that you are restoring is full of heavily detailed points regarding mainly Hindutva-driven criticism of the subject whereas most of the article is clearly not about that. That's why I had made a simpler version for a lead to cover the necessary points without going into too many details. Capitals00 (talk) 18:50, 29 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Though I'm not averse to simplification, I think, perhaps, you oversimplified the content in the lead. The section on Assessments and Legacy is long and detailed and reducing it to one sentence (admired and criticized) is overly simplistic. You might want to write a longer summary that includes major opinions on why he is both admired as well as criticized. Also, for the purposes of consensus, it might not be a bad idea to propose the change on the talk page first.RegentsPark (comment) 18:59, 29 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The current leads talk too much about temple destruction, a notion that has been already conclusively addressed in scholarship. Same with those executions which were politically motivated, not religiously.

The current paragraph is:

Aurangzeb has been described as one of the most controversial rulers in Indian history,[6] though his rule has also been the subject of praise.[7] Multiple interpretations of Aurangzeb's life and reign over the years by critics have led to a very complicated legacy. Some argue that his policies abandoned his predecessors' legacy of pluralism and religious tolerance, citing his introduction of the jizya tax and other policies based on Islamic ethics; his demolition of Hindu temples; the executions of his elder brother Dara Shikoh, King Sambhaji of Maratha[8][9] and Sikh Guru Tegh Bahadur;[10][11][d] and the prohibition and supervision of behaviour and activities that are forbidden in Islam such as gambling, fornication, and consumption of alcohol and narcotics.[12][13] At the same time, some historians question the historical authenticity of the claims of his critics, arguing that his destruction of temples has been exaggerated,[14][15] and noting that he built more temples than he destroyed,[16] paid for their maintenance, employed significantly more Hindus in his imperial bureaucracy than his predecessors, and opposed bigotry against Hindus and Shia Muslims.[17]

It should be changed to:

Known for creating the largest Indian empire, he was the longest reigning monarch of Mughal empire. His rule has been the subject of praise and criticism. Some of his critics argue that he policies abandoned his predecessors' legacy of pluralism and religious tolerance and while others rejected these assertions arguing that he employed significantly more Hindus in his imperial bureaucracy than his predecessors, and opposed bigotry against Hindus and Shia Muslims.

Of course, I will add the sources. Capitals00 (talk) 12:16, 30 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Can you please explain why are you calling the original paragraph Hindutva? It is not religious or political if it is simply reporting history. I would say that it should be changed back to what it was as this is the more accurate and comprehensive description of Aurangzeb. Understand1528 (talk) 15:27, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ping RegentsPark. Capitals00 (talk) 05:06, 1 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

• Looks good though I'd tweak the language a bit, mainly to connect the main arguments of the two sides. How about this. Known for being the longest reigning monarch of the Mughal empire and for creating the largest Indian empire, Aurangzeb also has a complicated legacy. His critics, citing his actions against the Sikhs and his conservative view of Islam, argue that he abandoned the legacy of pluralism and tolerance that characterized the early Mughal emperors. Other scholars, however, reject these assertions, arguing that he opposed bigotry against Hindus and Shia Muslims and that he employed significantly more Hindus in his imperial bureaucracy than his predecessors. Technically you don't need to cite anything since this is the lead, and all the material is in the body, but, given that this is Aurangzeb, .....! RegentsPark (comment) 16:40, 1 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

  I would replace “the largest Indian Empire” with “one of the largest Indian Empires.”

  it is generally disputed whether Aurangzeb or Ashoka’s empire was larger. SKAG123 (talk) 01:00, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Add the tamplate of Auranzeb at the end of the article.

• .(Sulaymaan114 (talk) 13:18, 29 November 2023 (UTC))[reply]

WP:COMMONNAME applies, so I have changed the spelling from "Auranzeb" to "Aurganzeb" in the name of the template and in the template, so it is now called Template:Aurangzeb

-- Toddy1 (talk) 16:42, 29 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

There are two official biographies of Aurangzeb written by Mughal court historians in Persian. Alamgirnama written by Mirza Mohammed Qasim and Maasir-i-Alamgiri by Saqi Mustad Khan. I propose to include a reference to these official biographies. Any objections may be registered here. PastaMonk 10:00, 21 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No because they are primary sources (see WP:PRIMARY.

I would support including quotations from these sources if it adds anything of value to the article. SKAG123 (talk) 02:44, 5 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There should be no objections to merely explaining that they exist; actually using them is more tricky. Johnbod (talk) 04:15, 5 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]